Results 1 to 6 of 6

Thread: Odd Notation

  1. #1
    Forum Member OldStrummer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    Northern Virginia, USA
    Posts
    3,928

    Odd Notation

    To me, at least.

    Sorry, this question doesn't seem to fit another forum, so I'll ask it here. And it's probably a real newbie question. I think I have part of the answer, but I'm hoping someone can point me to a defining authority. Here it is, with some explanation:

    I'm okay with reading charts where the chords are noted as such: C - F - Am - G7 - F#m7 and such. But some of the charts I have for worship songs I'm playing have a notation I'm not familiar with. For example, one piece has the following: A - Asus -A5 - A.

    Now, I know that Asus is a suspended chord, but is it a suspended second, or a suspended fourth? Or, heaven forbid, a Asus2sus4? And what's this A5? Now, my handy-dandy chord finder suggests that this is a sequence:

    A is, of course, the movable barre form, fretted2, fretted2, fretted2. I'm guessing the Asus is fretted2, fretted2, fretted3. I think the A5 is openA, fretted2, fretted2, and then back to A. At least it seems to work in context of the song.

    But then we move on and I have D2 - A - Bm7 - E(4). D2? I'm guessing that's another suspended chord: open-.D, fretted2, fretted3, open-e. But what's with the E and a parenthetical 4? It's the only way E is represented throughout the song.

    I can play the first sequence as a straight A chord, D2 as a straight D, and the E(4) as a straight E.

    So what's with the weird notation?

    (I learned using chart diagrams, so no interpretation was necessary).



  2. #2
    Forum Member Offshore Angler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    New York Finger Lakes Area
    Posts
    8,462

    Re: Odd Notation

    Sus chords have no thirds, so they sound wide. Unless the noted otherwise, the third is replaced by a fourth. It is sometimes a second.

    So take an A chord: the scale has 3 sharps, F#, C#, G#

    The intervals are:
    1 2 3 4 5 6 7
    A B C# D E F# G#

    So the A major triad is 1-3-5 or A, C#, E

    If we replace the "3" or third, with the fourth we play triad A, D, E. Since the interval between the major third and the 4th is only a half step, you simply move the third up one fret to have a sus chord.

    If we had an A minor we have a flatted third, so the triad is A, C, E. If since the three is already a flatted, moving down one fret creates a sus2 chord.

    If your chord form on the guitar covers more than one octave it is customary to only replace the third on the highest octave.

    Example: a simple A chord can be 002220 which EAEAC#E. By moving the C# up a fret we get 002230 which is EAEADE.

    A number in parenthesis - generally is just an extended chord but always use your ear since the use of parens can vary widely. Sometimes it denotes what fret, etc.

    Since the sus chord has no third, it can be used to create a path to a chord change, it's ambiguity creates a tension that can get resolved with the next move.

    It's also on the first page of the playbook for playing rock and roll right after the 7th chord. Keith Richards and the rest of the Rolling Stones got extremely wealthy playing sus chords!

    The defining authority is learn your theory. It makes playing a lot easier.

    Chuck
    "No harmonic knowledge, no sense of time, a ghastly tone, unskilled vibrato, and so on. Chuck is one of the worst guitar players I know" -Gravity Jim

  3. #3
    Forum Member OldStrummer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    Northern Virginia, USA
    Posts
    3,928

    Re: Odd Notation

    Thanks, Chuck. It's not the theory I'm lacking as much as it is understanding the notation being used. When no chord diagrams are used, I'm having difficulty understanding what 'Asus' refers to. 'Asus2' or 'Asus4' is clearly more definitive. In my previous post, I was also confused by why the 'E' chord was notated as 'E(4)' rather than E4. Does the number in parentheses refer to the chord (e.g., 'Esus4') or perhaps to an inversion of the major? If the former, why not list it consistently, as with the 'Asus'? There is no legend on the sheet music, so I don't have a frame of reference.

    I have software that enables me to add chord diagrams to a sheet of music, but when I plug in 'E(4)', it just comes up blank. 'E4' on the other, gives me some chord options.

    (Let me just say that when I was first learning guitar, tab(lature) notation hadn't yet been formalized - let me show you my Robin Trower songbook from 1974 - and so I never learned to read tab. In the same way, listing chords by some esoteric method strikes me as being in the same vein).

  4. #4
    TFF Stage Crew
    Moderator
    pc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Posts
    7,522

    Re: Odd Notation

    Established nomenclature has no (4). I too would assume they mean sus, however, I sometimes see E(5) on sheets to mean a power chord, i.e., only root and fifth and no higher notes. Maybe they mean that?

    I can tell you that when you see Asus, it (is supposed to) always mean sus-4 unless specifically notated as sus2.

  5. #5
    Forum Member S. Cane's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    Ever heard of José Carioca?
    Posts
    4,651

    Re: Odd Notation

    Interesting thread, chord theory is vital for richer playing.

  6. #6
    Forum Member OldStrummer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    Northern Virginia, USA
    Posts
    3,928

    Re: Odd Notation

    Quote Originally Posted by Sérgio View Post
    Interesting thread, chord theory is vital for richer playing.
    Indeed. The guy I'm playing with is an acoustic player, sometimes finger-picker, and I've never seen him play above the fifth fret (where there's no money, they say). He's told me on several occasions that he never plays a "straight" major or minor chord, preferring always to use suspendeds, augmenteds, 9ths, minor 7ths, etc. In our upcoming duet Sunday, he's pretty much asked me to accompany him with the "basic" chords. It actually sounds pretty good, although I want to learn more on how he does it.

    We practiced today and set up the stage and sound. We're getting together again tomorrow afternoon (did I tell you we lost our singer to a death in the family?) since we're down to a duo now.

    I did find that I thought some songs worked (for me) better with a Strat and others with my 12-string. Hey, maybe tomorrow I'll take my ES-335! :)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •