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Thread: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

  1. #1
    Forum Member Old Ranger's Avatar
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    How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    Not wanting to hijack de Melo's thread on showing pedal boards, and wanting to understand something in my old brain, I posted this thread.

    So....

    Just how many sounds do you really need? Think about it for a moment before you hit the respond button and say you have to have hundreds as you're an international cover band and NEED 150 different settings to cover everyone. Be realistic here OK? Do not confuse effects with the overall sound. OK, now here we go...

    Now I've been playing these things since JFK took his oath of office. Then we had little, if any, effects around. We all had about one or two sounds then. Now when Nixon came into power so did the effects. We had a bunch. And by the time Clinton was creating a stain with Monica, our effects were legion. But did we get an equal amount of new sounds as well? Taking a no BS realistic look at things I can say no. Sure we got lots of new distortion, phase, flange, chorus, and delays right? But that's just what they were. The same things packaged in different boxes. Some more classy than another, but overall they made the same general sound.

    Then the multiprocessor made the scene. Good grief, those things gave us too much! So many options to choose that one could spend six months with one and just begin to scratch the surface of what it could do. But how many sounds did one get? I have a theory. In fact I figured it all out.....

    We got four sounds we really use.

    1. Clean
    2. Distorted (some more some less)
    3. Delayed (loopers are delays that stay on)
    4.Special (tremolo, phase, flanged, etc.)

    And that's it. No really, it is. Think about it. You get yourself a box full of pedals and in an hour's time you got four sounds. Even from 50 pedals, you got four basic sounds. Then get a big fancy processor and do the same thing. In the end, after hours of fiddling around with it you got four basic sounds. That's it. Four....

    I got four similar things programed into my Mustang I amp that are spread out over 24 setting. But when you get down to it they're all pretty much the same thing. And I didn't plan on having just four settings either. I used different amp modes, different delays, changed all sorts of things, but I ended up with four basic sounds. I can go from preset to preset and I have unconsciously dialed in four basic sounds in them all. Did the same thing with a huge Zoom monster processor with 200 patches to build. Of all that horsepower available to me and all those varied forms of everything it all boiled down to basically four sounds. Astonishing yes? No, not really. Remember, we got four basic sounds. I shouldn't have been surprised....Sure we vary them a might here and there, but distortion is distortion. Delay is delay. And so forth.

    So blast away at my theory if you like. Take pot shots at it all day but in the end there's still only gonna be four sounds. I'll be polite and patient as you shout and curse me for blasphemy. I'll just smile since I know we got four sounds and sooner or later you'll see it as well.
    I forgot what I was going to say...

  2. #2
    Forum Member Doc W's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    I will get the rope, you guys carry the torches, and we can finish off this geezer now....

    Actually, Ranger, I am with you on this, perhaps because I am another old guy. I would make the pedal requirement even less. Dirt pedals have almost always been a replacement for amp overdrive and date from the days when getting distortion in small venues with big amps became a problem. The solution was a pedal or master volume amp that gave distortion at low levels. Nowadays, with everything being miked, it is possible to get distortion the old-fashioned way with blowing eardrums by simply using a smaller amp with the volume set in the danger zone but the guitar rolled back just enough to clean it up. Most of my amps (50s and 60s Fenders) do just that.

    Most of my playing now is in the church worship band, composed mostly of younger guys who grew up with lots of effects. I have resisted most of the sounds you call "special" just by adding a little more delay and maybe tremolo to give a kind of spacey sound. I know its not the same thing but it gives an "impression" especially when I use my Tele super clean through my old Princeton Reverb.

    I bought a dirt pedal, just for the church gig, but I resist even that now. I just try to convince the other band members to rearrange the song a little. Mostly it works, if the song has a good melody and good text.

    So, here is my church set up:

    - Princeton Reverb with super clean Weber NeoMag 10
    - tuner pedal
    - delay pedal

    And that's about it. The church is about 125 years old, a great big building, and it has an awfully nice natural reverb, so I could probably get away with less, but I use my amp as its own monitor and I do like to play with delay. Mostly I just set it and leave it, dialing it up more for a particular song.

    You are probably thinking "yah, and he probably sounds really boring." Well, I am not a guitar hero, but I get sufficient compliments on my playing and my sound to convince me that I am doing the right thing for this venue.

    My small club setting would be the same except I would use the delay more depending on the room. If I play larger gigs again (and that may happen), I would use a Deluxe Reverb if the PR didn't cut it.

    Now, having said all that, I have heard lots of players make some pretty rich sounds with very creative use of multiple pedals, so I am not knocking anyone else. I just hate a lot wires and I date from a time when there were a lot less.
    "The beauty and profundity of God is more real than any mere calculation."

  3. #3
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    The reality for many players is they need many different sounds, different distortions, and different effects settings. Not just one to four overall sounds will work. Sometimes that requires several pedals or a processor.

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    Forum Member Don's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    I just got back from jamming with guys from a band that ended several years ago. I had the pedalboard that I posted a pic of last night.
    The best sounds that I got (by far) where when I bypassed the pedals and counted on my Tele and 5E3 tweed Deluxe (both nice clones) for all of the sounds that I needed.
    It really sounded good.

    Of topic- it was a bittersweet feeling playing with these guys. We're all good friends going way back and really play well together but are all in different band for various reasons.

  5. #5
    Forum Member Rickenjangle's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    I usually need clean, clean with jape on it (echo'ed) and clean with trem...slightly overdriven, with delay or trem. Heavily overdriven, and heavily overdriven over the top with delay.

    So with my pedals (Tube Screamer, SD-1 Super overdrive, tremolo, boost, delay, and amp reverb, I do everything...sometimes I stomp on a wah wah pedal too.

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  6. #6
    Forum Member Old Ranger's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    Well I've gone through some pedals when they began to appear. I even fell prey to the "gear before the ear" syndrome just like everyone else did for a while. But then I soon discovered that you can only re-invent the wheel by adding a tire to it, and they did that long ago. The rest is just hubcaps added on for looks. So like my car, with four wheels, I have my basic sound. Got four and no "hubcaps" to speak of really on either.
    I forgot what I was going to say...

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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    I won't be too presumptive when eyeing someone's pedalboard, because I've been throught the whole gambit from guitar straight in to an amp to that "rack-type" stuff.
    I'll say that I've settled on three or so pedals that I use regularly, even though my board has eight on there (I have a reverb pedal in case of emergency).
    Back in the day when I was playing blues exclusively I always heard gripes from the blues nazis about my pedal board. "You have to work harder for your tone if you don't 'rely' on pedals" was a line often repeated. What kind of BS is that? As if being tonally austere was some sort of manly badge of honor. lol
    The band I was in opened for Duke Robillard, & he had more pedals than Van Camps got beans. Bunches & bunches, & even several of the same kind. And from what I could tell he used them all. And that guy is more than a purist, he's a preservationist in my book. I got over trying to accomodate those in the local blues society after that. If it's ok for Duke then it's ok for me.

  8. #8
    Forum Member Old Ranger's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    Ahhh, I heard something about clean sound and varied overdrive and both with some delay and tremolo? Something about running straight into the amp with no effects on at all. Clean with a hint of trem and use of delay. Maybe a dirt box or just the amp's OD. Having a few short of a dozen pedals but only three or so actually used. Hummmmmmm. Now call me an idiot, but I'm seeing a pattern here, don't you? Doesn't appear that there's more than about four sounds going on here. Maybe I'm not an idiot after all.
    I forgot what I was going to say...

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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    Ranger, I can think of 1 other useful sound from a stomp box, the EQ. I have found that using extreme settings gives my steel a most realistic dobro sound. A little tweaking using the Tele, and one can get a beliveable acoustic sound. (Of course I wouldn't part with the myriad other pedals, just because!)

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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    Quote Originally Posted by Old Ranger View Post
    Maybe I'm not an idiot after all.
    Anything is possible.

  11. #11
    Forum Member smitty_p's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    Old Ranger, I pretty much agree with the categories you've laid out. Bill Moore does make a compelling suggestion when he mentions EQ, though.

    However, looking only at your list for the moment, there are a number of subsets under each main listing, which you've acknowledged in your parenthetical comments.

    For me, I have to admit to a bit of cork-sniffery when it comes to clean. There's a whole world under the heading of "Clean." When I play, I almost always have to have my Stratocaster and my Les Paul (or my SG). Why? Sometimes I need that Strat clean and sometimes I need that Les Paul clean. They ain't the same! Then, thar be amps. 6V6 clean and EL-84 clean are different, too. I actually tend to contemplate more about which guitar I should use for clean than distorted.

    When it comes to delay, that's a whole realm, too. I get a little OCD about that, too. Do I need a generalized, echo-y delay, or do I need a precise delay with defined subdivisions (dotted-eighth, quarter note, etc.) and precise, tap-tempo?

    Ain't guitars fun!

  12. #12
    Forum Member chuckocaster's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    Give me a dirt box, boost, and something I can fake a Wurly or Hammond with and I'm a happy man. If I could find something that sounds like Fogerty's trem from the CCR era I'd be really happy! Other than that, I'm good. I gotta have the guitar and amp "magic" happening first though, cuz if it ain't, I ain't gonna play well. No FX in the world fixes that!
    "don't worry, i'm a professional!"

  13. #13
    Forum Member Doc W's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    There is another aspect to this. When I am working in a studio, I often need more variation than in a live situation. Playing live, I like to keep it very simple, very straightforward.
    "The beauty and profundity of God is more real than any mere calculation."

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    Forum Member blackonblack's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    Well I can say that I have 20 unique patches I created in my AXE-FX II. Of those, 18 are for electric guitar, so I guess 18 is my answer HA.

    I will say that 80+% of my gigs are CCM and I can do 75% of a normal CCM setlist with 1 patch. That patch does have an OD, 2 delays, a shimmer, and a boost available on it.
    Mark

  15. #15
    Forum Member jeru's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    Quote Originally Posted by Old Ranger View Post
    We got four sounds we really use.

    1. Clean
    2. Distorted (some more some less)
    3. Delayed (loopers are delays that stay on)
    4.Special (tremolo, phase, flanged, etc.)

    So blast away at my theory if you like. Take pot shots at it all day but in the end there's still only gonna be four sounds. I'll be polite and patient as you shout and curse me for blasphemy. I'll just smile since I know we got four sounds and sooner or later you'll see it as well.
    OK -- deep breath. Wait for it --

    I don't disagree.

    Variations on a theme. I'll only say that for me, the variations are where the fun is.

  16. #16
    Forum Member Old Ranger's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    I'm still chuckling here in my little hut. This is fun.

    It's kinda like in the world of archery. There's four bows.

    1. Straight bow (longbow, flat bow, etc.)
    2. Recurve
    3. Compound
    4. Crossbow

    Some folks say that only a longbow should be used as it helped shape the fate of Europe. Others speak only of the ultra technological designed super compounds of today. They say those are the way to go. The crossbow is said to be the easiest to shoot and has lots of power. Then the graceful shape of the recurve is just plain pleasing to the eye. Yet they all do basically the same thing. They all launch a fletched shaft with a point that hits a target if used correctly. That's it. Nothing more other than like jeru said about variations on a theme.

    So, yeah, I'm sittin' here in my little shack in the woods playin' Nugent-like stuff for my cats making them all loose their minds. Oh, and it's just my guitar and the amp's own OD makin' it happen. Today it's "Pedals? We don't need no stinking pedals!". Tomorrow it's likely gonna be some fingerpickin' stuff with delay, or chorus, and such. You know. One of the four sounds I got. Just to confuse my cats!
    I forgot what I was going to say...

  17. #17
    Forum Member Direstraits's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    I'm totally in agreement. My basic pedal board consists of a compressor, RAT & an old Arion delay pedal (with reverb on the amp). I also have a Digitech multi FX processor on which I have a variety of pre-sets purely for convenience, which are all variations of Compression/Reverb/delay/ (sometimes) modulation /distortion or OD, so I have the set up for a particular tune ready at a couple of taps on the pedals.

    When You point your finger 'cause your plan fell through, you've got 3 more fingers pointing back at you.

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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    But you could add such reductionism to say that we really only have one sound. Volume, that's it.
    Think about it: what's the first thing you do when you go to play guitar? You turn it up. Or down. And what are tone controls but volume controls for specific frequencies. Delay? It's just repeating sounds, giving them volume again same w/chorus & anything else we add. Everything boils down to that single thing.
    So there's really only one thing: Volume

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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    A friend of mine plays in a band that covers rock from the 50s to current. He had a pedal board of around 25 pedals but recently replaced it with a rack setup (midi pre amp/processor, Boogie power amp, and a few other gadgets). He has settings programed in many cases just for one song. When they play Sharp Dressed Man he sounds just like the album, Hold The Line sounds just like the album, Satch Boogie, Beatles, Stones, Elvis, Aretha, Prince, Van Halen, Benatar, Scorpions, Etta James, U2, Beach Boys, Ozzy, Petty, and so on just like the album.

    There are a lot of pedals and processors on the market. Some players find them very useful tools.

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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    Quote Originally Posted by chuckocaster View Post
    If I could find something that sounds like Fogerty's trem from the CCR era I'd be really happy!
    Try the Fulltone Supatrem.

  21. #21
    Forum Member Rickenjangle's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    I still hold to my original statement - for ME - I have about 6 basic sounds, plus occasional wah.

    But if you want to reduce it -

    1. Clean with just 'verb
    2. Clean with effects
    3. Overdriven
    4. Heavy drive

    The fact that I have an even heavier drive when combining 2 pedals doesn't negate the fact that it's heavier drive. Plus, there's a booster pedal in the mix so I can get "pushed clean" or "pushed light overdrive" if need be.

    But seriously - what I'm trying to do is have the right tone, at the right volume, and employ occasional trems and delays to accent a part of a song. I cover a lot of ground, and I'm the singer, arranger, bandleader, lead guitarist, and erstwile soundman. So for me, it's all about simplicity and repeatability but I never could get an amp to behave the way my little 5-pedal pedaboard does, night after night.

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  22. #22
    Forum Member Volumeknob's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    My Mustang amp has been on the same setting/patch for ----er uhm.....6 months.......so that would be 1 for me.
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  23. #23
    Forum Member phantomman's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    My personal TO&E for guitar effects is pretty fundamental -- a decent overdrive (Fulltone OCD V2), an old flanger (AC-powered A/DA, from the early Van Halen era), a convincing amp simulator (Zoom G1X), an A/B/Y switch for multiple signal-chain routing (Radial Big Shot), and -- periodically -- a Dunlop Crybaby. The G1X offers several stand-alone effects as well (slap-back delay, phaser/chorus, acoustic & 12-string simulator, a couple of differently-voiced fuzzes, a tremolo/vibrato effect, and multiple types of reverb) but I seldom use those.
    "When injustice becomes law then rebellion becomes duty."

  24. #24
    Forum Member Old Ranger's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    This is a riot!
    We've gone from just discussing four basic sounds to the entire set up of processors, pedal boards, banks of effects, and all the little gizmos to change sounds. But I guess if someone really needs 200 patches with all those oddities built into them who am I to say anything? I'm just a redneck half-breed living out in the woods with too many guns shootin' hogs and armadillos. So I'm gonna go plug into my cheezy Fen-day-hoe (as my old shop owner used to call Fender) S.S. amp that gets no respect, with my cheap ass guitars and have fun. Imagine....just clean with reverb and OD with reverb? Guess I'm being cheated huh!

    So remember kids, keep saving and sending in your boxtops and you'll get your Super Secret Squire Squirrel Decoder Ring complete with the chrome plated plastic framed mirror sunglasses as our free gift to you. Just pay additional shipping and handling. Act now. Supplies are limited!

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    details. Void where prohibited. Tax, title, dealer's prep, and additional costs not included in this offer. Some restrictions apply. This concept has been known to cause cancer in the state of California. But then again, ANYTHING causes cancer in California! I once saw a gypsy moose play a mandolin in his underwear at a senior center in Iowa. That sight still haunts me. To this day I cannot play a mandolin in my underwear and not think of that gypsy moose. He had some good lick though. His rendition of Stairway was beyond belief. But he lost me with his version of Black Dog. Some say a moose should never attempt to play Led Zepplin. Something about the antlers.....
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    Quote Originally Posted by Old Ranger View Post
    This is a riot!
    We've gone from just discussing four basic sounds to the entire set up of processors, pedal boards, banks of effects, and all the little gizmos to change sounds.
    ? You included all this in your first post.

  26. #26
    Forum Member Old Ranger's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    I sure did. That was just to indicate that even with all sorts of efforts now, and in the past, I still got 4 basic sounds no matter what I use. But that's OK since no one ever takes me seriously.... Well they did when I was on the job haulin' them in for some nefarious criminal act. Not many were smilin' and joshin' with me then! Ahhh, life is a gas!
    I forgot what I was going to say...

  27. #27
    Forum Member Rickenjangle's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    Quote Originally Posted by phantomman View Post
    My personal TO&E for guitar effects is pretty fundamental -- a decent overdrive (Fulltone OCD V2), an old flanger (AC-powered A/DA, from the early Van Halen era), a convincing amp simulator (Zoom G1X), an A/B/Y switch for multiple signal-chain routing (Radial Big Shot), and -- periodically -- a Dunlop Crybaby. The G1X offers several stand-alone effects as well (slap-back delay, phaser/chorus, acoustic & 12-string simulator, a couple of differently-voiced fuzzes, a tremolo/vibrato effect, and multiple types of reverb) but I seldom use those.
    This from the with one of the finest Fender amp collections on his side of the Rockies. !

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  28. #28
    Forum Member Offshore Angler's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    Depends.

    In the studio the sky's the limit. Live at the local craphole - a delay, OD, RAT, chorus and compressor will cover almost any need.
    "No harmonic knowledge, no sense of time, a ghastly tone, unskilled vibrato, and so on. Chuck is one of the worst guitar players I know" -Gravity Jim

  29. #29
    Forum Member melody's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    The 4 sounds I use are, Tele , 335, Strat , Les Paul... I have never been a pedal kinda guy...

  30. #30
    Forum Member Rickenjangle's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    Quote Originally Posted by Offshore Angler View Post
    Depends.

    In the studio the sky's the limit. Live at the local craphole - a delay, OD, RAT, chorus and compressor will cover almost any need.
    For those of you newer TFF folks, Chuck (OSA) and I used to play together in a band, and he literally had that stuff...and used mostly just the overdrive into a Fender DRRI and got a wide range of sounds - often from just one Tele or Strat - in one evening...using his volume and tone knobs and pick attack to vary the sound. And for anyone who thinks that 22 watts of clean Fender power won't cut it - well, I beg to differ. His DRRI used to smoke almost any amp I came to gigs with - with the possible exception of my Vox AC15 which used to hold its own pretty well.

    Quote Originally Posted by melody View Post
    The 4 sounds I use are, Tele , 335, Strat , Les Paul... I have never been a pedal kinda guy...
    Melody, what's your amp? Are you getting channel switching and reverb from that? Or are you doing the blues purist thing with nothing between your guitars and amp but a cable? I always admire guys that can do that but in my case, I've got to cover at least 3 decades of music so I need the extra tone toys.

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  31. #31
    Forum Member melody's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    I would never consider myself a blues purist but yes guitar, cable, amp. I use a 71DR most time's I also have a 5E3 clone. I use the guitar's volume knob for solos and to sit back in the mix when I am covering the rhythm parts. I admire guys\gals who can keep all that going on and still stay true to the song..

    My gets all confused as to witch pedal goes where in the chain what's on or off or basic use of pedal's so I have never monkey with them. I do hear a lot of cool sounds others get from them just not my bag I guess...

  32. #32
    Forum Member phantomman's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rickenjangle View Post
    ......in my case, I've got to cover at least 3 decades of music so I need the extra tone toys.
    +1
    "When injustice becomes law then rebellion becomes duty."

  33. #33
    Forum Member gibsonjunkie's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    I started out late in life and have been able to build (literally) a pedalboard with a bunch of different pedals. I love learning how the different effects affect the sound and how they inter-relate with each other. That being said, the few odd times I actually play in front of people, I like to plug directly into the amp.

    "We catched fish and talked, and we took a swim now and then to keep off sleepiness." Mark Twain

  34. #34
    Forum Member Rickenjangle's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    Quote Originally Posted by melody View Post
    ...yes guitar, cable, amp. I use a 71DR most time's I also have a 5E3 clone. I use the guitar's volume knob for solos and to sit back in the mix when I am covering the rhythm parts.
    OK, a follow-up question - I know the 5e3 will break up pretty good at a reasonable volume but how do you get liquid overdrive sounds at usable small-club volumes with the DR? Or are you mostly clean with just a pushed clean sound for your leads?

    "I'm gonna find myself a girl
    that can show me what laughter means
    And we'll fill in the missing colors
    In each other's paint-by-number dreams..."

  35. #35
    Forum Member smitty_p's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    In answer to the questioning title of this thread, "How many sounds do you REALLY need?"

    Just one more....

  36. #36
    Forum Member lure555's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    This is a subject near and dear to my heart. I started out with a rack setup in the late 80's. Got some good tones, but wanted to go more "primitive." Got into the pedalboard game, the heart of which were 3 of those Line 6 bricks. Got some really good sounds. I would obsess over the settings, making sure to tailor the patches to each song. Thought I had it nailed. Then I heard a live recording of me and the band. You know what? Other than when I hit the wah for one or two songs, all I heard were clean sounds and dirty ones. That's it. Really put things into perspective for me. I'll reevaluate when I replace The Edge in U2. ;)

  37. #37
    Forum Member melody's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rickenjangle View Post
    OK, a follow-up question - I know the 5e3 will break up pretty good at a reasonable volume but how do you get liquid overdrive sounds at usable small-club volumes with the DR? Or are you mostly clean with just a pushed clean sound for your leads?
    I try to push the front of the amp with my guitar volume \ tone. For smaller room's with the DR I will put a wah in my path but rarely use it other than turning it on and leaving it set where I get some push to the front turning up the guitar..

    My question for people with muti pedals in the path do you feel it tends muddy the sound, or sucks some of the highs off for a more pleasing sound?

  38. #38
    Forum Member lure555's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    Most of my pedals are True Bypass. I've done some experimenting and can say that I barely notice a difference. In fact, they've had so little effect on my tone that I've taken my VHT Valvulator out of the signal path.

  39. #39
    Forum Member Offshore Angler's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    I don't have any issues with highs rolling of either. The only pedals that are notorious for that are tuners , and the BOSS seems to have that problem licked.

    Buy good quality and let your ears do the voting and you'll be fine.
    "No harmonic knowledge, no sense of time, a ghastly tone, unskilled vibrato, and so on. Chuck is one of the worst guitar players I know" -Gravity Jim

  40. #40
    Forum Member Rickenjangle's Avatar
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    Re: How many sounds do you REALLY need?

    I like to find the pedals that work for me and stick close to that formula - at least when it comes to gain... TS9 and SD-1 - my old standby's...and the best thing for me is to start with all controls of both pedals at 12 noon - and then tweak slightly back and forth, but for some reason I don't need extreme tweakage to find my sound with these pedals. As for tremolo - an effect I like to use - I have a BBE Tremor pedal - but here's the rub - it's got a pair of speeds you can set, but I wish they'd included a pair of depth knobs as well - 'cause I like a slow, shallow throb tremolo and a fast, extreme chop as well. So it's always a compromise with the depth knob.

    "I'm gonna find myself a girl
    that can show me what laughter means
    And we'll fill in the missing colors
    In each other's paint-by-number dreams..."

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