That wear looks right fr an old guitar that started to ear and chip in that area. It was likely sanded smotth remove the chipping adge and clearcoat shot over it to help seal and stop it. That's probably the "partial refin".
That wear looks right fr an old guitar that started to ear and chip in that area. It was likely sanded smotth remove the chipping adge and clearcoat shot over it to help seal and stop it. That's probably the "partial refin".
I see it as a good sign. Great guitars get played. If it was me , I would book a $250.00 airfare and check out that guitarOriginally Posted by solsurfr
It would make a great weekend trip. You would get to play the guitar and inspect it.
A small price to pay on a vintage guitar purchase of that amount. I would also suggest a subscription to Vintage Guitar magazine
Good luck my friend.........
I'd love to be able to swing a flight and check out the guitar. Can you help me figure out how to swing that by my wife before she castrates me? lolI see it as a good sign. Great guitars get played. If it was me , I would book a $250.00 airfare and check out that guitar
Been a subscriber to VG for a few years now. Great mag.
Philly Guitar show is coming up so I'll get to lick my chops around early November. When does the madness end??
'13 20th R9 Murphy
'13 Believer Burst #003
'13 Redeye #007
'13 Fender '52 WW10 Tele
'12 Fender '59 WW10 Strat Braz
'10 Goldie #008
'10 Dr. Z Maz 18NR
'03 R9 Aged Braz
'03 R9 Braz
'02 Martin OM28JM #360
'97 Fender '58 Strat (Gene Baker MB)
'68 Marshall JMP50 & '68 1960A Cab
'65 Fender Del. Rev.
'61 Gibson ES-335 TD
'59 Gibson TV Model
'59 Fender Tweed BM
'42 Martin 0017
When yourWhen does the madness end??starts listing your stuff on the bay.
"When injustice becomes law then rebellion becomes duty."
That's not when it ends. That's when it gets interesting!When your
When your
'13 20th R9 Murphy
'13 Believer Burst #003
'13 Redeye #007
'13 Fender '52 WW10 Tele
'12 Fender '59 WW10 Strat Braz
'10 Goldie #008
'10 Dr. Z Maz 18NR
'03 R9 Aged Braz
'03 R9 Braz
'02 Martin OM28JM #360
'97 Fender '58 Strat (Gene Baker MB)
'68 Marshall JMP50 & '68 1960A Cab
'65 Fender Del. Rev.
'61 Gibson ES-335 TD
'59 Gibson TV Model
'59 Fender Tweed BM
'42 Martin 0017
For what it's worth, I own a late 59 strat with no neck date and a body date of 2/60. Neck plate serial number 40120. All pots date from 48 week of 59 and the guitar appears very much the same, especially in the fine details. I would agree with you about the arm wear, but as another poster said, it may have been sanded and resprayed in that area to avoid further deterioration and wear. I'd ask about that one. My particular guitar is hands down the best strat I've ever played and the tone is there in spades. I've had the chance to play quite a few over the years, this one is truly special. The neck on my 59 is rather thin at the nut and gets big towards the twelfth fret with a nice C profile. If you do decide to buy, I can't imagine you will be disappointed. The late 50's early 60's are some of the best strats ever produced. Good luck.
Thank you for the feedback. It's been since removed from eBay so it may have been sold or the seller just didn't relist. Would love to own it if I could unload a couple of my CS stratocasters!!!
'13 20th R9 Murphy
'13 Believer Burst #003
'13 Redeye #007
'13 Fender '52 WW10 Tele
'12 Fender '59 WW10 Strat Braz
'10 Goldie #008
'10 Dr. Z Maz 18NR
'03 R9 Aged Braz
'03 R9 Braz
'02 Martin OM28JM #360
'97 Fender '58 Strat (Gene Baker MB)
'68 Marshall JMP50 & '68 1960A Cab
'65 Fender Del. Rev.
'61 Gibson ES-335 TD
'59 Gibson TV Model
'59 Fender Tweed BM
'42 Martin 0017
What does that mean?
You own a 1960 strat,
That's what I'd say, lol
Da's da fac', Jack!
"When injustice becomes law then rebellion becomes duty."
What does that mean? You own a 1960 Strat.
You make the call. late 59, early 60, what's the difference. Were talking about fine details from the same time frame. I thought it might be helpful to hear from someone who has factual info in his hands.
Kind of like high school around here.
Last edited by dbruno; 11-24-2009 at 04:43 AM.
The difference is the date. High school is you wishing you had a 59. Sure the features are all the same, but if you had to advertise that guitar, it would be legally called fraud to try to sell it as a '59.
with a 2/60 body date, it's not likely that it left the factory before March of that year.
Jeez, why would you say that?
All the info out there says that serial nos. were not necessarily chronological & neck dates were not employed consistently, so when you have an actual DATE written in one of the cavities then it should be considered the guitar's "birthday".
Last edited by Cogs; 11-24-2009 at 01:03 PM.
P music is my dealer and they are on the up and up
Best reputation in this town
What are you 16 Wilko? I guess my original and follow up post wasn't clear to you. I'm going to edit it and make it say "I own a 1960 strat" just to help you get past your mental limitations.
Think about what your trying to debate me on. Your arguing weather or not I have a 59 or 60 strat and I'm trying to tell the guy about the similarities between these two guitars that appear to be only a few months apart, just so he has a reference to compare to. Do me a favor and stop stepping on my posts.
Last edited by dbruno; 11-24-2009 at 02:06 PM.
You're done here. Thanks for stopping by.
I guess I lost. You showed me. You are right dbruno. You have a very rare and desirable 1959 stratocaster that was made in 1960. I'm happy for you and sincerely apologize for having called your judgment into question.
Cool... thanks... can you stop in and ask if that '59 is still for sale? How 'bout a tone report?? Just kidding... well... yeah, only kidding.
'13 20th R9 Murphy
'13 Believer Burst #003
'13 Redeye #007
'13 Fender '52 WW10 Tele
'12 Fender '59 WW10 Strat Braz
'10 Goldie #008
'10 Dr. Z Maz 18NR
'03 R9 Aged Braz
'03 R9 Braz
'02 Martin OM28JM #360
'97 Fender '58 Strat (Gene Baker MB)
'68 Marshall JMP50 & '68 1960A Cab
'65 Fender Del. Rev.
'61 Gibson ES-335 TD
'59 Gibson TV Model
'59 Fender Tweed BM
'42 Martin 0017
Here's one their calling a 1959 Blonde, notice the 1960 neck plate sn#, a penciled 8-58 body, and a 3ply guard ??? A hardtail to boot..
And ash to boot!Here's one their calling a 1959 Blonde, notice the 1960 neck plate sn#, a penciled 8-58 body, and a 3ply guard ??? A hardtail to boot..
"When injustice becomes law then rebellion becomes duty."
So what are they doing, averaging out the dates? lol
A '60 plate & a '58 body is quite a spread. I think it could be a mongrel there.
That serial could easily be 1959.
For the record, my 5/60 is 50609 (with the serial on the bottom of the plate)
According to my personal data base, the serial for that blonde hardtail is within the range for a 1959 instrument.
"When injustice becomes law then rebellion becomes duty."
Ok I'm home from work now & looking at Duchossoir's book. That ser no. (41897) falls w/in the '59 range:
39252 body date 10/59
41996 body date 11/59
But c'mon guys- an 8/58 body date? & a 3-ply 'guard? Heck, it looks cool, but I'd guess it all depends on what they are asking for it.
I do know concerning my old '59 (ser no. 43168, body date 10/59, neck date 3-61) there was a wide enough spread in the dates that it was considered to have "issues" by some dealers.
I'm not saying that guitar has issues. Just that if I were seriously considering buying it I'd want to take an EXTREMELY close look at it. I do think it is interesting that there doesn't look like there is an "extra" screw hole between the p'ups, telling me that the 3-ply 'guard would seem to be stock & not changed from the single-ply that would certainly be on a '58. I guess you could ask, has anyone ever seen a '58 w/a 3-ply 'guard?
Last edited by Cogs; 11-25-2009 at 02:53 AM.
Rob, another tip-off to the originality (or lack thereof) of the pickguard on this guitar would be the presence of the "shoulder" in the control cavity for the extra pickguard mounting screw.
"When injustice becomes law then rebellion becomes duty."
Hey, Phantomman - I liked your Murrow quote so much I put it on the billboard in front of our office for the past two weeks, and it will probably stay up until the end of this month. Thanks for the idea.
(Sorry for the hijack. We now return you to your regularly scheduled thread).
No shoulder:
But 10 screws:
Looks original. Dang. I've never seen a '58 w/a 3-ply pickguard.
I was just googling trying to find a pick of a guard like that. I had seen one before. that's NINE screws.
The other version has TEN with a screw on the treble side almost even with the middle pickup (like on an SRV).
"When injustice becomes law then rebellion becomes duty."
Indeed. It's a nice one! And I'd hazard that it's 100% authentic.
It's another reason why the 58-60 era is so fascinating to vintage Strat fans.
"When injustice becomes law then rebellion becomes duty."
Cut me some slack. I'm only working on a single cup of coffee at the moment!
Your old 59 looks beautifulOk I'm home from work now & looking at Duchossoir's book. That ser no. (41897) falls w/in the '59 range:
39252 body date 10/59
41996 body date 11/59
But c'mon guys- an 8/58 body date? & a 3-ply 'guard? Heck, it looks cool, but I'd guess it all depends on what they are asking for it.
I do know concerning my old '59 (ser no. 43168, body date 10/59, neck date 3-61) there was a wide enough spread in the dates that it was considered to have "issues" by some dealers.
I'm not saying that guitar has issues. Just that if I were seriously considering buying it I'd want to take an EXTREMELY close look at it. I do think it is interesting that there doesn't look like there is an "extra" screw hole between the p'ups, telling me that the 3-ply 'guard would seem to be stock & not changed from the single-ply that would certainly be on a '58. I guess you could ask, has anyone ever seen a '58 w/a 3-ply 'guard?
I knew the Blonde would stir things up for this ThreadIndeed. It's a nice one! And I'd hazard that it's 100% authentic.
It's another reason why the 58-60 era is so fascinating to vintage Strat fans.
You know that we are all sick picking apart these Strats..
Sorry, I meant "old" as in "formerly".
Sad to say it didn't play well. It could have, though. It had tiny frets & a three-way switch, but they were stock frets that were like new & the wiring was complete w/out a single broken solder joint. I knew I couldn't touch it & make it to my liking w/out it taking a big hit value-wise, so I offed it for a wheelbarrow full of money & got something like a daily driver. And a bunch of other stuff, too, lol!
I'll try to dig up some more pics.
It's a little shocking to me that someone here would beat on a guy about his vintage strat that he owns when the guy was just trying to be helpful to someone else. I haven't posted here in a longtime and not sure I want to after reading all of that. Did I get it right that the moderator shut down the guy who actually didn't instigate anything and was trying to be helpful to the actual thread?? There is a possibility that a body that was being prepared for the beginning 1960 production run could have been shipped late in the year as a 59 if it was ordered. Remember, they were made right around the corner from at least a dozen guitar shops in a 50-100 mile radius. It could have been given to a pro player who got it right from the factory in late 59 as leo was prone to making sure working musicians had guitars in their hands before anyone else. Many reasons could exist for it to be in the public hands and still have that date and be a 59. It could have gone back to the factory for sometype of work or refin and given that date while it was there. I would have taken offense by the tone if it was mine as well. Not so much the opinion given but the air of superiority given to it. At least he has a vintage instrument to play instead of a WAY overpriced custom shop.
blues: get em!
The guy was not being helpful at all, and no one beat on him. I just called out that his guitar was a 1960 strat.
He said he had a 1959 strat with a 1960 body. How is that helpful?
He got all defensive because he wishes he had a '59 strat and probably tells people that he has a '59 strat because it sounds cooler than saying he has a 1960 strat. Fuck him. he's a whiny bitch.
By that logic I could spring for a set of original '54 Bakelite pickup covers offa Ebay, stick 'em on my 1999 MIM '50s Classic Re-issue, an' veritably claim "Look......I've got a '54 Strat!"
It don't work that way, pal. Try it at the Dallas show and you're liable to git your ass drop-kicked right offa the goddamm planet.
An all-original vintage guitar cannot be dated any older than it's newest part. Period. End of story.
The gentleman last night couldn't grasp basic time-line reality and he chose to show his ass rather than reason intellectually. His own attitude earned him his so-called beat-down.
"When injustice becomes law then rebellion becomes duty."
The guy was condescending & hurling insults, period. He WAS the instigator. He didn't seem take correction well either, so he got the boot.
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