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Thread: Another chord followed me home today

  1. #1
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    Another chord followed me home today

    ...And now I need a name for it. Here it is in context:
    5X665X = AΔ7
    X3545X = CΔ7
    X8755X = FΔ7
    6X775X + ??
    What would you call this chord, & why?

  2. #2
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    Re: Another chord followed me home today

    Bbmaj7+11 (Bb major 7 sharp 11)

    (As an aside, I need to figure out how you get the cool major Delta symbol and also the diminished symbol you used in the other thread!)

    I call it Bb because there isn't necessarily a harmonic context to think of the root as anything but that, since the preceding chords really don't fit into any preordained key, per se.

    maj7 because it's the same chord as the Amaj7 you start with, aside from the top note.

    +11 because usually when you're thinking in major chords, especially maj7 chords, the standard nomenclature places that note as a +11 rather than thinking of it as a b5. Same note of course and nothing really wrong with calling it Bbmaj7b5, it's just that generally you won't see that.

    Conversely, when you have a dominant 7 chord, you WILL generally see it spelled as Bb7b5 instead of Bb7+11. That's because the +11 sound is ultra-common in maj7 chords, meaning that a piano player would voice that note as an extension rather than lower in the chord structure.

    Oh... finally, why am I calling it +11 instead of #11? There really is no rule for that one, just kind of how your local community does it most frequently. They mean the same thing (because the + sign in jazz always means "augment" (as in sharp) rather than "add"). For whatever reason around here, stemming from the conservatories at Capital University and Ohio State University, for no particularly good reason the "sharp eleven" is always written as +11 instead of #11, even though you'll see other augmented tones using the # symbol.

  3. #3
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    Re: Another chord followed me home today

    Those crazy symbols I found in MSWord. Select the "Insert" tab & then click on "Symbol". A menu will drop down & they're in there somewhere.
    Thanks for the chord construction lesson!
    Last edited by Cogs; 10-17-2009 at 11:41 PM.

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    Re: Another chord followed me home today

    Glad to help!

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    Re: Another chord followed me home today

    BTW, I found all those symbols on the Mac keyboard by using the option/alt key and various letters, but it appears using any of them are violations of the TFF software sprites, and all of them threw the "Forbidden..." error code when I tried to post them just now.

    Dang.

  6. #6
    Forum Member DanTheBluesMan's Avatar
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    Re: Another chord followed me home today

    so the + sign means sharp and not add, interesting.

    in the Beatles to a T, the subtitle shows an E, then an E+, what chord is that? E sharp is an F, so now I'm confused.

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    Re: Another chord followed me home today

    A chord with only a plus sign means "augmented," which is another way of saying "sharp 5th."

    I.e., it would be spelled E - G# - C

    It's rare that you'll see a major chord (no seventh indicated) with the plus sign. It's more common that you'd either E7+ (E - G# - C - D), but I have seen charts with just the chord name and the plus sign. You have to just listen (or think in context) to decide what seventh (if any) you want to put with it.

    If it's heading to a B chord, then the flatted seventh works great (D natural on top), but if not, adding a natural seventh (D#) might work great too. Or again, just no seventh at all.

    HTH.

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    Re: Another chord followed me home today

    Oh... The plus sign raising a note is seen BEFORE the note it's raising. Like in my example, Bbmaj7+11.

    When the plus sign is by itself with nothing after it, it simply means "raise the fifth a half step."

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    Re: Another chord followed me home today

    Quote Originally Posted by pc View Post
    BTW, I found all those symbols on the Mac keyboard by using the option/alt key and various letters, but it appears using any of them are violations of the TFF software sprites, and all of them threw the "Forbidden..." error code when I tried to post them just now.

    Dang.
    Sometimes when I get that situation (like when posting a photo URL w/a % sign in it), I can't seem to get the post to stick unless I hit "go advanced" first. For Mac users, sometimes it's a harsh world out there
    Last edited by Cogs; 10-20-2009 at 08:27 AM.

  10. #10
    Forum Member Doc W's Avatar
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    Re: Another chord followed me home today

    Quote Originally Posted by pc View Post

    It's rare that you'll see a major chord (no seventh indicated) with the plus sign.
    This is true! The only time I see it is in older music, Beatles and pre-Beatles (I have some original 1930s-40s sheet music, for example, and you see +5 but less 7+5). I wonder why that is the case.

    I remember learning guitar from Beatles songs in the early 60s and they loved the +5. I have several young guitar students very interested in early Beatles and I love showing them since it is an easy and painless way to stretch their chord knowledge.
    "The beauty and profundity of God is more real than any mere calculation."

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