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Thread: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

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    Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    Hi Folks,

    This question will probably reflect upon my lack of knowledge regarding all things which pertain to "classic" tone and true Stratocaster vibe, but please be kind with me as I try to learn.

    I have posted previously regarding Strat pickups. In particular, I tend to use my Strats like "Swiss Army knife" sort of guitars, in that they may be asked to play anything from jazz clean on the neck pickup all the way to classic rock (by which I mean a bit of Van Halen, AC/DC, etc) on the bridge pickup. While I love the clean Strat sounds on the neck pickup, I have found myself really struggling to get the bridge pickup to sound good with a moderately-high degree of overdrive, be it via a tube amp or using a pedal. The bridge pickup has sounded rather thin and shrill-sounding when really pushed -- at least to my ears -- but I may just not be doing things right. Recently, it was suggested to me (on this forum!) to incorporate the tone control to effect the bridge pickup -- I plan to try that when my main Strat comes back from a fret job. But I digress...

    In the meantime, I was looking around the internet for ideas to possibly try for replacement Strat pickups. The only names I could think of off on the top of my head were Dimarzio, Seymour Duncan, and Lace. I have now stumbled across a few higher-end (?) brands of Strat pickups(?): Rio Grande. Van Zandt. Lindy Fralin. I am sure that there are others, but the really surprising thing to me is that those three "gourmet" pickup manufacturers seem to ONLY make SINGLE-COIL Strat pickups. I guess I had always assumed that Fender used the single coils to save a few pennies, and that serious Strat players typically scrapped the OEM Fenders for something else which I (wrongly!) assumed would be some sort of noise-cancelling pickup. I am now learning that some folks just insist on true single-coil pickups, even when purchasing some really expensive upgrade pickups.

    I am just trying to put some perspective into my line of inquiry regarding Strat pickups. I had until now been looking exclusively at noise-cancelling pickups such at the "stacked" designs and the Holy Grail (I have a set of Holy Grails -- nice and quiet, but they do not handle overdriven tones well for me). Maybe I am missing the mark? Perhaps some of the single coil designs would work well for me, and I just have been ignoring them because I was never really looking at anything that was not noise-cancelling? (After all, I must bear in mind guys like Eric Johnson who can get a fabulous over-driven lead tone out of vintage single coil pickups). This all raises a question in my mind: I can see the advantage of noise cancelling designs; conversely, is there a (tonal) advantage to staying with the (classic) single coil design? Are there ways to manage the hum (and neon sign cross-talk) that I haven't considered?

    Sorry for the long post. I appreciate any insights.

  2. #2
    Forum Member chuckocaster's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    the problem with stacked pups, noise canceling another way, and the whole road lots of people have traveled to cure the noise problem is that it all comes down to physics, and magnetic fields.

    there is no way to make a single coil silent and still retain the tonal attributes of that design. they are by nature noisy, that's that. when you start getting into taps, stacked designs, air coils, and the such you immediately start to loose their flavor. this comes from many different features, coil size, size of magnets, etc. it all plays a part in the way a pickup sounds. the height of a coil, how wide it is, how tall the magnets are, how big around the magnets are.

    fralin and people of that ilk have taken years dissecting excellent sounding vintage pickups, reverse engineering them. i know a guy who even put magnets through a machine to see exactly what the material makeup of alnico they were. they've spent thousands of hours to make quality new pickups that are like the old ones. there are many guitarists who scrutinize over this stuff, and the manufactures of boutique products also.

    now granted there are plenty of people cashing in on the whole "voodoo juju" that shrouds many of these products. evidenced by how many different pickup makers there are. and that's not to take anything away from anybody. but what my point is is this, quality materials, assembled in a professional manner, with great attention to detail is what that game is all about.

    there are plenty of people who can buy parts from stewmac and start winding. they may make a decent product, they may not. everyone has to make a living, but you have to do it with honesty.

    we guitar players are real suckers for "buy this pickup and you'll sound like mr. (your fave guitarists)". it's an easy sales pitch cause let's face facts, most guitars are built to a price point, and that's fine. but there are plenty of us that get tired of the parts that came in our guitars, and usually the pups aren't the greatest. so, we get aftermarket pups. we really lust after the "classic" tones we've heard on different recordings, and the aftermarket is where we turn to to fine tune our tool (guitar).

    enough rambling on my end. you can try shielding your cavity in the guitar, but that does impede the tone of your instrument, it will cut down some of the high end. this may or may not be a bad thing, it depends on the guitar. you can also run shielded wire, this might help a little.

    it all becomes a trade off, do you want your classic tone, or do you want it to be quiet and not buzzy. just remember that 98% of the people in the audience usually won't be able to tell a difference. those other two guys standing in front with their arms folded in front of them will.


    i personally am not bothered by the hum, i can live with it. to me it is part of the sound.

    but it is your guitar, there is no right or wrong, just what you think is best.

    best of luck to ya. from one to another
    "don't worry, i'm a professional!"

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    Forum Member Kap'n's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paultergeist View Post
    I am now learning that some folks just insist on true single-coil pickups, even when purchasing some really expensive upgrade pickups. .
    I also understand that some folks insist on hum-cancelling pickups and sheilding, even though a well wired set of single coil pickups played clean or with tasteful levels of overdrive will have much more chime, clarity, air and definition.

    It's all in what you want.
    Several guitars in different colors
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    I have a lot to learn about these things; I guess I never took into account the degree to which "everything effects everything else," sound-wise.

    Chuck, I really appreciate the time you took to express your perspective and experience regarding this issue. Speaking of quality -- and this is not to detract from the Holy Grails -- but I was absolutely shocked when I looked at the underside of those things. The base of my HGs is a printed circuit board (PCB) material -- irregularly cut and with what appeared to be some PCB traces that lead to nothing (cut off). The friend who helped me install them said it looked like the builder used PCB "waste material" as a base for the pickups. I was concerned that I was cheated and had gotten some knock-offs (bought these mail-order), so I called Lace to ask if that is how they built them? Yep. They said it worked just fine. I just thought it looked horrible, but what do I know?

    I guess I need to draw a few more reference perspectives on what really "good" single coils sound like, since I really wasn't paying attention before. I have a good friend who recently got a new Strat with "Texas Special" pickups, or something like that -- in the guitar as new. I guess I'll see if I can borrow that guitar for a little while, just to give my ears a chance to listen to some real single coils.

    Kap'n, thanks also for responding to my query.

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    Forum Member chuckocaster's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    no problem man, i think you get it, we all have our thoughts and feelings in the matters of tone. and this is the best forum for these discussions to take place, cause everyone here lets everyone else do their thing and contribute what they know.

    the pcb thing doesn't really surprise me, it happens A LOT! i too though would be disappointed.

    like i said though, when it comes to tone, there is no right or wrong, just what works for you.
    "don't worry, i'm a professional!"

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    Forum Member Kap'n's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    IMHO, (and a lot of other folks as well) hot wound single coils tend to kill off most of their best qualities. I'm pretty partial to the set of Fender '54's which came in my Strat, which are 5.9K on neck and middle, and 6.5K on the bridge.

    One thing that's important, is for them to sound their best, you don't play the instrument exactly like you play a LP, for example. They will sound bright. However, play a strat for a half hour, and you'll find the picking techniques and positions that bring out the best sounds. And, yes, a tone control on the bridge can help, but isn't always necessary.

    Blender wiring is also handy. This wires the first tone control as a master, and uses the second tone control to fade in the bridge or neck pickup whenever the other one is present. Pretty nifty.
    Several guitars in different colors
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    Forum Member chuckocaster's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    yep. i'm a proponent of the bridge tone control. i also flip the mid and bridge pup leads going into the switch. i never use the mid/neck combo and i like the two outside coils together sound. YMMV.
    "don't worry, i'm a professional!"

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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kap'n View Post
    IMHO, (and a lot of other folks as well) hot wound single coils tend to kill off most of their best qualities. I'm pretty partial to the set of Fender '54's which came in my Strat, which are 5.9K on neck and middle, and 6.5K on the bridge.

    One thing that's important, is for them to sound their best, you don't play the instrument exactly like you play a LP, for example. They will sound bright. However, play a strat for a half hour, and you'll find the picking techniques and positions that bring out the best sounds. And, yes, a tone control on the bridge can help, but isn't always necessary.

    Blender wiring is also handy. This wires the first tone control as a master, and uses the second tone control to fade in the bridge or neck pickup whenever the other one is present. Pretty nifty.
    WORD!

    Some of the "Strattiest" tones I've ever heard came from under-wound pickups, or those so old that the magnets had lost significant amounts of their original properties.

    As to picking styles, the Kap'n speaketh the troof......to "mine" the best tone from a Strat (or a Tele FTM) you gotta dig deep! You'll git the best results from a more aggressive attack than you might use with a Gibson or other HB-equipped guitar. I find that Fender's "extra-heavy" 351C picks and a set of 10-46 strings work the best.

    True SC pickups will introduce noise into the signal path -- they's no gittin' around it. But you can minimize this by using premium shielded cables and installing a full-size shield beneath the pickguard (not that tone-hogging copper paint in the cavities though!).

    Wiring the number two tone control to the bridge pickup gives you the option of rolling off some highs when appropriate and the blender pot configuration provides some additonal tonal variations as well (easily reversible if'n you don't find these mods to your liking).

    FTR, I got six Strats with several different brands of pickups mounted an' they all sound great to me (albeit different, for different applications). If you got a decent rig and you spent some time fine-tooning your effects or pedal board, you shouldn't have any prob finding one or more "sweet spots" that make your guitar sing.

    HTH


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    Forum Member Totally bored's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kap'n View Post
    I also understand that some folks insist on hum-cancelling pickups and sheilding, even though a well wired set of single coil pickups played clean or with tasteful levels of overdrive will have much more chime, clarity, air and definition.

    It's all in what you want.

    Riasing hand, I'm one of them.

    I must use noiseless pups and happen to like the tone of my assortment of Dimarzio's. Many Clubs I play and including my house have bad wiring and I also gig with a Band that use's some lights that wreak havoc on single coils. It ain't no big thing. I have quite a few sets of Fender CS pups and stock Fender pups from various years pre wired on pickquards to occasionally compare to my noiseless pups and the trade off to me is worth it.

    It's really not all that much of a trade off IMO. I get great Fender stratty tones with my noiseless pups.

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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    I've found kinman pickups a pretty "single"-sounding. For me there are advantages and disadvantages of any type of pickups (single, stacked or hb). It depends of your musical and physical style of playing and other factors as string gauge, bridge and nut type and amps/effects. It all develops into your "gear-sets" as you are getting exprience with live/studio situations. For example I would use a lightweight guitar with humbuckers and schaller tremolo for live situation because it's easier to play for me and give me a raw versatile sound. In studio when I have the possibilities of many takes and sound editing I could use singles or whatever is suitable probably the huge necks for better sustain or even change the pickups for different parts of the song. For the large band I'm playing in the difference between noisless and single is very subtle in live situation. If you're solo artist and perform in front of the trio it could be critical, but Jeff Beck uses noiseless just fine and sounds awesome... and pretty "singlish" I would say, IMHO

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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    Wow! There are a lot of great insights contained in all these replies. I truly appreciate the sharing of these valuable opinions and observations.

    I have much to consider. My sincere thanks go out to all who replied.

    Paul

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    Forum Member Kap'n's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paultergeist View Post
    Wow! There are a lot of great insights contained in all these replies. I truly appreciate the sharing of these valuable opinions and observations.

    I have much to consider. My sincere thanks go out to all who replied.

    Paul
    Good luck in chasing the sounds in your head!
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    I was discussing this a bit further with my local guitar shop....I was also coming to the conclusion that I like the P-90-esc-sounding pickups in the bridge position, but most the P-90 modeled pickups I have seen do not come in a hum-canceling configuration. The local guitar tech suggested using a P-90 modeled Fralin or a Quarter-pounder, and then using a reverse-wound pickup in the center position. According to to this idea, I would still have hum-canceling in the 2 and 4 positions (of the 5-position) switch. Is this idea plausible? In other words, I would have essentially a humbucker in the 2 and 4 position?

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    Forum Member chuckocaster's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    the p 90s should be able to hum cancel in the combo position. research it more and find out what the polarity is of the pickups. i've done it in the past, a couple different ways. i built a strat with 2 p90s, both bridge positions, but the "bridge" one was wound hotter, and then combined that with a standard sc in the middle, rwrp from the p90s. i've also done one where the bridge was a p90 and the other 2 were regular single coils.

    the shop should be able to set you up with what you need to do this, granted they have an actual "tech" and not just some guy who sells pickups and changes strings.
    "don't worry, i'm a professional!"

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    Forum Member phantomman's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    Your luthier is essential correct.

    I have DiMarzio "Virtual Vintage Solo Pro" pickups (a noiseless design BTW) installed in the bridge positions of two of my Strats. They can sound pretty P90-ish to my ear with the appropriate effect/amp settings (an' yes, I have an original '57 Les Paul Jr in my collection for comparison purposes). You might find the DiMarzios a worthwhile alternative as well.

    HTH


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    Forum Member thegeezer's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    I have a set of DiMaggio virtual vintage and the just won't sound warm. I lowered them and that didn't help what do you think is the best height for this pickup.
    Jerry

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    Forum Member bluespower's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    any one have various wiring diagrams for the master tone and blender option?

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    Forum Member curtisstetka's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    It's been my experience that no single guitar can really "do it all" the way I'd like. I used to chase after that.

    Nowadays I've got a Strat, I've got a double P90 Tele-ish thing, I've got a humbucker / semi-hollow, I've got a Les Paul, etc. Each has its limitations and each has its sweet spot.

    Bear in mind too, when you're listening to a recording of your favorite guitarist and contrasting it to the tone you're getting out of your guitar amp, that's sort of an "apples to oranges" comparison. There's a lot involved in getting a particular sound on a recording and the guitar/pickups/amp is really only one component to the end result.

    I've experience with Kinman pickups. They're darn good.
    s'all goof.

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    Forum Member thegeezer's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    I love my Rio Grande pups they are so open and transparent, I am having a hard time adjusting to the DiMarzio to get that openness.
    Jerry

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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    Quote Originally Posted by thegeezer View Post
    I have a set of DiMaggio virtual vintage and the just won't sound warm. I lowered them and that didn't help what do you think is the best height for this pickup.
    Jerry
    Well the Virtual Vintage series pickups are Alnico 2 so they can be set higher than the Alnico 3 & 5 types. I set mine about 2.5 millimeters below the string on the unwound side, about 3.0 millimeters for the wound strings. Works well for me though YMMV. Your amp rig, pedal board, an' picking style also play a role in an instrument's performance.

    HTH
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    Forum Member thegeezer's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    I just find that they are a little harder sounding with my strat compared to my other stat with SC pups, especially with the higher stings.
    Jerry

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    Forum Member Offshore Angler's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    Quote Originally Posted by phantomman View Post
    WORD!

    Some of the "Strattiest" tones I've ever heard came from under-wound pickups, or those so old that the magnets had lost significant amounts of their original properties.

    Can I have an "Amen!"

    The secret is to use low output pickups that don't whack the front end so hard and compensate by turning up the amp's volume. You'll retain the trebly sting and bite of the pups and turning up the amp's volume will sweeten the lows and mids.

    The overwounds, to me, are relics from the 80's rock scene.
    "No harmonic knowledge, no sense of time, a ghastly tone, unskilled vibrato, and so on. Chuck is one of the worst guitar players I know" -Gravity Jim

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    Forum Member thegeezer's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    The virtual vintage is a hard pickup and I would trade them for some SC pups in a flash.
    Jerry

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    Forum Member Offshore Angler's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    Paul, the thing you should consider is that the amp is more important in the long run. Nobody will ever get the same sound out of the same pickups through different amps. There are unique voices to certain amps that will overpower pickup choice.

    Also consider that the sound that you hear live through a cranked Dual Showman isn't going to be replicated at the levels that most guys practice at - or even gig at at small clubs. The full body of what you hear is the result of the sound system. The mic plays maybe the most important role ( after the player ) and then how the signal is routed at the board. You'd be suprised how many ripping solos were recorded clean and the effects added after the fact. In other words, that magical tone you want might not have sounded anything like that when it was done. Effects, EQ tweaks, mixing and mastering will have a major effect on how the recorded guitar sound comes out of your stereo's speakers.

    Next, the wasy your guitar sounds by itself in the practice space will be totally differnt than how it may sound in a band context. If you ever sat in the control room and had the playback going you might have had this experience. "Wow, my guitar sounds great, isolate that track." And when the other channels are punched off, you hear only your guitar and think - man, that sounds terrible. All thin and trebly and really dry. Then the other channels are brought back up and it sounds great again.

    Really, the marketing hype surrounding pickups is mostly hogwash. Throwing away the real junk, which does exist, and comparing stock pickups to boutique or even amongst quality aftermarket - the differences are MUCH more subtle than many would lead you believe.

    There are differences in the way say, some Strat SC pickups sound, but the differences are generally in the nuances, not in the overall sound. The rule of thumb I use is that hotter pickups bias the tone towards the preamp sound and lower output more towards the power section, but by judicious use of the guitar and amp tone and volume controls I can generally tweak the those aspects out. What Great pickups have is the same sound of your guitar at present, just better articlation and definition, and better balance. Your guitar will generally still sound very similar to the way it did before, just more refined and responsive.

    Now, if we change from SC to HB pups, we get a bigger difference, but the "essential oils" of the guitar and amp have remained unchanged. Scale length, set v bolt on neck, bias type, tube and speaker types make a much greater difference.

    Pickups are sortof like tubes in that repsect. You can pull out a set of crappy worn out 6L6's and put in NOS tubes. The amp will sound better, but it will still sound like 6L6's.

    I guess what I'm saying is that if you upgrade your guitar's pickups, you can enhance it's character, but not change it's character.
    "No harmonic knowledge, no sense of time, a ghastly tone, unskilled vibrato, and so on. Chuck is one of the worst guitar players I know" -Gravity Jim

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    Forum Member thegeezer's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    The guitar sounds good without plugging in. I thought it would plugged in too and I believe it will with SC pups.
    Jerry

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    Forum Member wingnut1's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    Jerry, you can get a set of the Guitar Fetish 60's Repros for $60. That's what I have in my Strat with the Maple board. They're a heck of a deal.

  27. #27
    Forum Member thegeezer's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    They are currently out of stock but thanks for the tip, you strats got a pretty good tone.
    Jerry

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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    Thanks, everyone, for the additional feedback.

    A special thanks to you, Offshore Angler, for your lengthy and thoughtful post. I have enough experience to recognize just how true your words are about the importance of amplifiers, effects, band setting, etc. In my case, I think I big part of the issue I have been contending with in my electric guitar playing has been the phenomenon of not being able to hear my own guitar playing very well along with the band. Usually, I do a sound check and I think that the guitar is already too loud, but then when the rest of the band starts playing, my solo guitar playing seems to get buried in the sonic haze. There is a sense of "sound pressure" from my amp, but I often cannot audibly distinguish my own playing.

    This problem has plagued me for a long time. Part of the problem is the amount of distortion. I play in a band that does a lot of Latin rock (think "Santana") and that type of tone just seems sort of "heavy" in the band mix. It seems like the notes are hitting the floor.

    Recently, I borrowed a friend's Strat which actually had some "Texas" something-or-others in it -- real single coils (SCs). The Strats I have typically played don't seem to handle the distortion as well as humbuckers -- at least in my hands -- but my friend's Strat seemed to do a betting job of "cutting through" the band mix and being heard in the ambient soundstage. Part of that may have been that I used a tad less distortion with it. I will point out that all of my Strats have some sort of noise-cancelling pickups in them: quiet, yes, but not getting me into a decent over-driven tone. I have been thinking, however, that maybe I should take one of my own Strats, put some real (good) single coils in it -- and see if the SC have some quality that allows them to punctuate through the air better than a humbucker?

    Then again, it is probably all in my head. My brain is ajar.

    Thanks again.

  29. #29
    Forum Member thegeezer's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    You are on to something, with less distortion and SC pups. Santana really isn't that dirty of a tone, but the amp is working. That is what my ears tell me and I also play a little of Carlos in our group. Good luck on you quest.

    Jerry

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    Forum Member Offshore Angler's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    PG, ( your new express name )

    You just figured it out. Playing with too much distortion will always, and I mean always, bury you in the mix. The only way to overcome too much distortion is to turn up the volume, and then the mix goes away.

    It's the first thing I look for when evaluation a player. It shows poor technique. Often, they are trying to use preamp and pedals to cover the fact that they have poor sustain in their technique. So the gain gets cranked, pedals light up and viola!, singing violin-type sustain - that won't cut through a mix to save its life. And now, the guitar's volume control is useless so dynamics are out of the equation.

    Most people need to REALLY LISTEN to some famous guitar solos. Guess what, most of those are recorded a lot cleaner than you remember.

    Clean is good. If you need more dirt, generally your amp is too big for the application at hand.

    I'll bet the Strat that cut better had lower output pickups and you had to use less gain and more power setion. Cut comes from the power tubes.
    "No harmonic knowledge, no sense of time, a ghastly tone, unskilled vibrato, and so on. Chuck is one of the worst guitar players I know" -Gravity Jim

  31. #31
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Offshore Angler View Post

    You just figured it out. Playing with too much distortion will always, and I mean always, bury you in the mix. The only way to overcome too much distortion is to turn up the volume, and then the mix goes away.

    It's the first thing I look for when evaluation a player. It shows poor technique. Often, they are trying to use preamp and pedals to cover the fact that they have poor sustain in their technique. So the gain gets cranked, pedals light up and viola!, singing violin-type sustain - that won't cut through a mix to save its life. And now, the guitar's volume control is useless so dynamics are out of the equation.
    Hey Offshore Angler,

    I think you are spot-on with your diagnosis, and your description really seems to nail the effect which I have been struggling to put into words. Although I do not play anything with the sort of gain of modern "nu-metal," etc, I do love the "violin-type sustain" of players such as Eric Johnson -- and hence I am probably still erring on the side of too much gain/distortion, etc. I have also noticed the effect of pre-amp tube distortion tending to be a bit fizzier/buzzier than power-tube distortion, and I may need to spend more time with a couple of my effects pedals to try to really get them dialed-in. Perhaps some of those pedals can do more help for me (i.e., compressor) than I have come to appreciate thus far.

    Right now, my main Strat is having some work done on it, and I am trying to decide between going back to the Holy Grails or upping the ante and putting some Lindy Fralins (P-90 voiced in the bridge) in it. I may need to consider the economic side of this idea as well, but at least I would know that I was trying some real single coils if I tried the Fralins. The Holy Grails work okay, but I don't think they have handled any amount of distortion very well -- at least not in my hands. Lots of things to consider.

    I am most grateful for the thoughts and opinions shared on the forum.

    Much thanks,

    Paul

  32. #32
    Forum Member Kap'n's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    Gotta have mids in there too. Scooping 'em out gives you a lot of 'loud nothing.'

    FWIW, the OCD is the only pedal I've played with with lots of gain (by my standards) that doesn't get 'lost in the sauce.'
    Several guitars in different colors
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    what is "a lot of gain"? If I use RAT with gain on 3 o'clock - it's a lot of gain for me. Cuts the mix just perfectly.

  34. #34
    Forum Member thegeezer's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    I use a TS 9 and use very little gain, instead I use the pedal as a clean boost which gives you that OD but with clarity.
    Jerry

  35. #35
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    Quote Originally Posted by thegeezer View Post
    I use a TS 9 and use very little gain, instead I use the pedal as a clean boost which gives you that OD but with clarity.
    Jerry

    That's gerally how they work best. A TS 9 is an overdrive pedal, so that's what it's supposed to do.

    One needs to be evaluate the use of pedals on a case-by-case basis. A pedal that works good on cranked blackface will not give the same results on an AC 30, etc. Or even the same blackface at different volume or EQ settings. Case in point, my effects chain has two different OD's - one works better in smaller venues with the amp set low, and another works better higher volumes.

    But back to the original premise of the thread - it's all really about using your hands and ears together. If you have a good guitar and it's equipped with pickups that are generally accepted as being quality devices, then the rest is really up to you as a player.
    "No harmonic knowledge, no sense of time, a ghastly tone, unskilled vibrato, and so on. Chuck is one of the worst guitar players I know" -Gravity Jim

  36. #36
    Forum Member thegeezer's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    Yeah but having a EQ that helps you feel good about your tone is a big factor on how well those hands work. You got to love your tone or you will be fussing all the time. I spend time learning about anything I buy simply by playing it and finding what sounds good. Than at least you have a base tone to work from. I did a side by side tone test of my BJ and DRRI and the BJ didn't hold up in the tone dept in comparison to the DRRI. But I used to use the BJ all the time, it's funny how that changed with a better sounding amp.
    Jerry
    Last edited by thegeezer; 11-19-2008 at 04:33 AM.

  37. #37
    Forum Member Kap'n's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Offshore Angler View Post
    it's all really about using your hands and ears together.
    Yep, so many players don't use their ears.

    If you don't use your ears, why are you bothering?
    Several guitars in different colors
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  38. #38
    Forum Member Offshore Angler's Avatar
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    Re: Single Coil vs. (skinny) Humbuckers?

    Best advice I ever got was "You have two ears and one guitar - do the math."
    "No harmonic knowledge, no sense of time, a ghastly tone, unskilled vibrato, and so on. Chuck is one of the worst guitar players I know" -Gravity Jim

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