Computer recordists - USB vs. Firewire?

[Rickenjangle]

I am thinking about getting some new gear with my tax refund. And have always enjoyed using tape deck-like recording but also have used Cool Edit Pro, SoundForge, and Cakewalk Sonar to record on the PC.

Well, I need a new PC anyway (mine is a PIII 667 MHz with about 512 MB of memory. I think that I can get into a pretty good laptop (15.4 monitor, 2 GHz - ish, 1 GB RAM) in the $600 range, and I am thinking of getting some kind of 8 channels-in interface.

Alesis makes a nice - looking unit, the iO/26 (8 mic pres with phantom, firewire) for around $400 and you can also get things like the Tascam US-1641 USB 2.0 with about the same features for the same price.

I like the tabletop aspect of the Alesis; the Tascam is rackmount-only.

But I wondered which is better, firewire or USB 2.0?
Are there other similar units that I should consider?
Is there a downside to trying to find a used Echo Layla/Gina setup (the ones that come with a PCMCIA card interface)?

Both units come Cubase LE recording software. I already have this covered, however. - unless my old s/w packages won't work on Vista.

[clayville]

My feeble two cents:

"Better" depends on what you need to do.
If you really think you're going to try and record up to 8 lines in at once, go Firewire for the data through-put.

But... if you're going to run your recording software on the laptop harddrive, you're going to need/want a ton of ram (more than 1g) and an external drive to record on anyway so you can relieve the read/write/drive pressure on the system drive, especially with lots of tracks recording at once. A Catch-22.

USB 2 is more than fine for a couple of sources recording at once, though. So... if needing lots of mics at once is only an occasional thing, you could in theory set your levels, etc via an external mixer and just send a stereo pair to the 'puter via, say, usb. Won't give you as many editing options of course, but it will capture it fine.

[Rickenjangle]

That's just it, Clayville, 2-in is what I have right now. So, I want to get into the ability to record a full drum kit with about 6 mics at a time, plus a couple of channels for me to record guide guitar and guide vocal, so that I can monitor those while overdubbing to the drum tracks.

Maybe I should just go with the Korg D3200. I just thought that I wanted to get a laptop anyway, so I should just go the Computer DAW route.

As for HDD space, the ones I've looked at come with 120GB of space, at least. Plus, I have a 120 GB hard drive right now in my PC that's an aftermarket replacement and is pretty speedy. I could wipe it, and put it in an enclosure and write to it for backup, I suppose.

Edited to add: Just a quick look at Circuit City online shows me my mind's memory is very poor.

The laptops in the $650 or less category that look good to me have at least a 160 GB HDD plus 2GB RAM. and are Intel Dual Core technology. So, it's better than I originally thought.

[Gravity Jim]

If you want to reliably record 8 tracks at once on a laptop, you want a Firewire interface.

The MOTU Firewire interfaces rock you like a hurricane, and there's one for pretty much everybody (it seems to me that whatever set of features you're looking for, MOTU builds one).

[geekroick]

wikipedia sez..

"Although high-speed USB 2.0 runs at a higher signaling rate (480 Mbit/s) than FireWire 400, typical USB PC-hosts rarely exceed sustained transfers of 35 MB/s (280 Mb/s), with 30 MB/s (240 Mb/s) being more typical (the theoretical limit for a USB 2 high-speed bulk transfer is 53.125 MB/s). This is likely due to USB's reliance on the host-processor to manage low-level USB protocol, whereas FireWire automates the same tasks in the interface hardware. For example, the FireWire host interface supports memory-mapped devices, which allows high-level protocols to run without loading the host CPU with interrupts and buffer-copy operations."

[Dan-yo]

i have the alesis multimix 16 firewire board, i've only recorded up to 6 tracks at a time so far, worked pretty well, but it also has to double as my live board, that's why i didn't get the I/O....a friend of mine is recording his entire band w/ the I/O 26 and he says it's working out really well...i saw that alesis is also starting to make the multimix in usb 2.0 but i think the prices are a little higher that the firewire ones right now...

[Mesotech]

The Firepod system works really well for recording multi-channel audio, and is about the same price as the Alesis. I would shy away from multi-channel USB, especially if you have many different USB devices connected at the same time. Unfortunately, with today's technology, you won't really know how many different USB devices you might have in the future, even if you don't predict any today.

You didn't ask about, and probably aren't considering (because you're focused on a laptop), but a good Prosonus PCI based package will outperform both USB and Firewire, and cost the same or less. Plus the Prosonus also doubles as an ASIO sound card, and is programmably routeable internally, and maintains it's own internal mixer (all controlled via software). This is the option I would look at closely, unless I was forced to use either USB or Firewire because I chose a laptop instead of a desktop. Between the choices you've listed, I would opt for the Firewire.

[bonefish]

i'm using the phonic helix 24ch board w/ firewire, into my desktop with reaper, and have been getting pretty good results so far-and the phonic is a great live board too.

[Rickenjangle]

I didn't look at the PreSonus FireStudio much but I can get that through the store at which I teach for a rockin' discount. Plus, I hear they make nifty laptop bags for recordists that have a pouch for the computer and a 2-space rack on the bottom. That might be just the ticket. And the laptop is pretty much the way I need to go because I want to be able to use the PC for normal PC stuff like work and word processing as well as web access - and not have to be down in my basement studio to do this kind of work. I might actually set up a home private net with my current computer acting as storage and stuff. I could actually be using the big hard drive as backup...

Lots of options; I'm looking for a big bang for my buck. Also, with the laptop, I could take my setup mobile. I also need to pick up a drum mic kit, and eventually would like a better LDC and a couple of SDC's- as well as another SM57 and a pair of 58's. So, figure I'll need to come up with another $800 - $1K for mics, cables, etc. down the road, although for now I've got friends who've got the mics I'd need that will loan them to me.

This is definitely not going to be a pro studio, but I want to DIY record my own music and be able to capture more than 2 tracks at a time - which is all I can do right now.

[mmcquain]

Sounds like you're getting some good advice... I'll add my 2 cents...
Go Firewire for anything over 4-6 inputs at once. Get the maximum amount of RAM your laptop will support (may be 2GB). You may need to remove both of the DIMMS (memory chips) that come stock with the laptop in order to do this - but it is well worth the cost. Heck, I'm running a 2GHz Dell laptop with 2GB of RAM for work (business/not music related) and often wish I had more. RAM is pretty cheap these days so get the max. And another reason for Firewire is for the external hard drive. I have an external enclosure that supports both Firewire and USB 2.0 and I always run it with the Firewire if the computer I'm plugging it into will support it (thankfully my laptop and home PC both do - but the USB is handy if I want to take the drive somewhere else and plug it in). I got the enclosure from CompUSA (they're going out of business and are dumping 'em cheap) or you can get 'em from other outlets as well.