Results 1 to 8 of 8

Thread: PA (mixer) tutorial?

  1. #1
    Forum Member bonefish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    whiteweird, SD
    Posts
    916

    PA (mixer) tutorial?

    trying to wrap my head around our new board (phonic helix 24). I know enough to get a basic setup out of it (mains, subs, moniters), i i think i can even suss out how to insert effects, but i still feel like there are some features i don't quite grasp yet, having only dealt w/ basic setups before.

    anybody know a good site that lays out the care and feeding of a four buss board (aux sends and returns, pre/post switches, groups, etc) in a fairly concise manner, preferably with some decent graphical representations?
    Röckin' nön-stöp ön my Föckin' Glöckinspiel...
    Bonefish on Myspace
    bonefish on facebook

  2. #2
    Forum Member javlib's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Pueblo, Colorado
    Posts
    356

    Re: PA (mixer) tutorial?

    The "Sound Reinforcement Handbook" written for Yamaha by Gary Davis & Ralph Jones, mine is the second edition and is a dozen years old, so it does not cover digital, virtual, computer based rigs. It is however the old school standard and covers all of the bases.

    I currently use a 40 channel, 8 sub groups, 8 aux sends, stereo mains which we use bi-amped (low freq cones & high freq horns) and the FOH mains hit a crossover feeding the sub woofers before the signal hits the amps. With this FOH scheme you have one last and final high freq/low freq adjustment for the room acoustics.

    I like:
    Pre-fade on the monitor (aux 1,2,3) sends
    Post-fade on the effects (aux 4,5,6) sends
    Aux 7 & 8 is a stereo send with pan that we use for a signal for recording live

    Monitors:
    The bass player, drummer, and percussionist share the same mix
    The guitars and horns share a mix
    The keybord player likes the vocal mix which is wireless
    We run seperate EQs, Compressors, and BBEs on each of these mixes as well

    Effects:
    I like to run effects (3 seperate signal chains) from aux sends and route the wet signal back into 3 other channels on the board, that way you can balance whatever you want between dry signals and wet signals (i.e. reverb/chorus on vocals). The sax sounds great with some of that juice too.

    Sub Groups:
    I like these groups:
    Kick drum and bass guitar in one group
    Toms, cymbals, and congas, etc in another
    Electric guitars by themselves
    Acoustic guitars by themselves
    Keyboards
    Horns
    Lead vocals
    Background vocals

    The kick drum, snare drum, cymbals and toms, bass guitar, acoustic guitars all go through seperate compressors before their signals even hit the board. For example the kick drum is set for a fairly firm gate on its compressor as it is suseptable to sympathetic low freq tones coming from the bass guitar signal in the stage monitors.

    I don't know if this is the best way to go, but it works for me. I can dial-in just about everything discretely and seldom deal with feedback. I can also control the overall volume pretty well, although most everyone wants it louder than what I like. This is in a six sided dome church sanctuary that seats 300 reved-up full gospel people.

  3. #3
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    75

    Re: PA (mixer) tutorial?

    Here is the best site I've found bar none:
    http://www.prosoundweb.com/
    It's for everything from raw begginers to the pros that record albums and do national tours. Start with the study hall to learn as much as you can. Then I'd suggest "lab lounge lite". Lots of regulars there but they get pissed if you ask questions that are in the study hall or have been asked millions of times before.

    One of the things that I picked up that works great is aux fed subs. It improved the clarity of my system immensly. It is a fairly new technique but very popular with those "in the know". Also read up on center coupled sub techniques.

    Hope this helps

    Doug

  4. #4
    Forum Member javlib's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Pueblo, Colorado
    Posts
    356

    Re: PA (mixer) tutorial?

    That's looks like a very good resource Doug, I'll spend some time there.

    Thanks, Jeff

  5. #5
    Forum Member bonefish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    whiteweird, SD
    Posts
    916

    Re: PA (mixer) tutorial?

    searched all up and down the web last night for the answer to one silly question, and found the answer, completely by accident, RIGHT HERE! (thanks chuckocaster!)

    like most things, i'm finding that hands on is the only real way to beat the learning curve. gigged w/ the phonic saturday night, using a bare minimum of features/inputs, and was pleasantly suprised at ease of set up and quality of the micpre's.
    Röckin' nön-stöp ön my Föckin' Glöckinspiel...
    Bonefish on Myspace
    bonefish on facebook

  6. #6
    Forum Member bonefish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    whiteweird, SD
    Posts
    916

    Re: PA (mixer) tutorial?

    okay, while i'm waiting for my registration email from prosoundweb to arrive, i'll ask y'all the same question-how would you set up this system?

    phonic helix 24 MkII mixer
    shs 2500- 2400W stereo power amp
    peavey PV900- 900W stereo power amp
    2)Peavey 115TLS cabs(1x15" w/horn,8ohm, 400W)
    2)SHS S15 cabs (essentially the same as the peaveys)
    2)peavey 118TLS sub cabs
    stereo 15 band eq
    stereo three-way crossover
    peavey MAQ300 stereo monitor amp (150W/side)
    4)12" w/ horns 8ohm floor wedges

    this is for a four piece alt.country/cowpunk band, 2 guitars, electric bass, drums, three vocalists. small clubs we just run vocals thru the board, eq, pv900 and a pair of mains, aux1 and aux2 for moniter feeds.

    for our larger venues and outdoor gigs, the options expand considerably-thinking about aux feed subs, which would require another x-over, and tri-amping, which would require another amp, both of which are in the budget.

    any thoughts?
    Röckin' nön-stöp ön my Föckin' Glöckinspiel...
    Bonefish on Myspace
    bonefish on facebook

  7. #7
    Forum Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    75

    Re: PA (mixer) tutorial?

    Well, I haven't looked up the specs on all this but your biggest problem is a power shortage. As a rule of thumb you want to have 1.5 to 2 times the power rating of speakers. I'd skip running stereo and set it up like this:
    Bridge the 900 for the tops (I assume you have a xover built in) and bridge the shs for the subs. Can't do much with the monitor amp as you'll have to run each aux into each chanel. With 2 speakers per channel, each one will only be seeing 75 watts.
    Run the eq on the mons. 31 band is way better than 15 but at least you'll have some help reducing feedback.

    As you have a stereo board, I'd run it as a modified aux fed subs. put all the vox pan hard left and run left out through the x-over to the tops. Low cut about 100. For the kick, floor and bass pan about the middle or a little right. run the right channel to the x-over and cross about 90 to 100.

    By doing this, you'll prevent all the low end wash going through the mics to reach the subs. Much cleaner and tighter sound. vox will be cleaner too.

    Center cluster the subs. Put them below the middel of the stage, cabs touching. You'll pick up about 3db that way and wont have phase cancellation problems.

    First thing I'd get is a new monitor amp. Then a 31 band eq. Sorry I'm not familiar with shs. Hope this helps.

    Doug

  8. #8
    Forum Member bonefish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    whiteweird, SD
    Posts
    916

    Re: PA (mixer) tutorial?

    thanks doug, that's pretty close to what i was envisioning. monitor amp has eq, and our stage volume is pretty sane-really just need mons for vox, so i'm not too concerned with that side of the system.
    Röckin' nön-stöp ön my Föckin' Glöckinspiel...
    Bonefish on Myspace
    bonefish on facebook

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •