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Thread: the real truth about mexican pickups

  1. #41
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Quote Originally Posted by Super Champ
    We were talking about pickups right?
    It might be hard to grasp but the humble pickup is kinda representative of what's happening in so many other facets of the economy. And who knows maybe you'll start a spending revolution that'll spread thoroughout the western economies.

  2. #42
    Forum Member Super Champ's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Kinman
    It might be hard to grasp but the humble pickup is kinda representative of what's happening in so many other facets of the economy. And who knows maybe you'll start a spending revolution that'll spread thoroughout the western economies.

    I do understand that. But, we went from "are mexi pups really not as good as Am" to "why the hell would one want to change pickups or buy a guitar, then change the pickups" to how pickups "somehow" pertain to the economy. Im sure you can dig deep (like what is going on) and come up with a reason but you've strayed so far from the subject at hand that it no longer pertains to pickups.
    Last edited by Super Champ; 08-23-2005 at 12:07 AM.

  3. #43
    Forum Member mgade's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Chris, I think you are making a classical "fallacy of composition"-error in your macro-economy analysis in post #40. Sorry, I haven't read the entire thread (sorta busy and on the job), but it is not true, that moving manual labour abroad necessarily makes Australian poorer. On the contrary it might make them wealthier because of the increased demand for goods and services from Chinese consumers. So this is less of a reason for worries. The real problem is the structural problems in those countries that can kiss a lot of manual labour goodbye. What will those people do that used to hold those jobs? On top of that - is a spread of the western lifestyle to the entire globe sustainable? The answer my friend...

  4. #44
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    It's funny how players get all on into this swapping and replacing and trying this and that, and then eventually, if they take their playing seriously enough over the years, end up with one or two preferences that really get the job done and they stop the modding and get on with the serious playing regardless of what their playing. This is not to say that modding a guitar is bad or wrong or has dubious politcal ramifications, it's just that it seems once a player reaches a certain point in their playing, the seem to concentrate more on making what they have work instead of looking for the answers in the latest, greatest gizmo just released from the Acme Answers Co.
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  5. #45
    Forum Member Offshore Angler's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Bob, and we agree yet again.

    Plus, I find the value is in buying it and playing it. I don't understand how buying a MIM, replacing three pups, the pots, the trem, and the tuners is any cheaper than just buying a decent guitar in the first place, except that the decent guitar is still worth something and the MIM is worth $300 no matter how much you throw at it. So, if you buy a guitar. own it for a few years and sell it, the cost of ownership is less if you buy the good one! And it was good from the get-go, so you got more utility from it.

    Chris, you bring up some good points, but I'd challenge som eof them. The cost of direct labor is usually pretty small. The reason the mported products cost significantly less in the US is often due to

    1) A flatter distribution organization - which shows that the "services economy" is a fallacy, and

    2) They are often subsidized.

    In my previous life, I was chief engineer for a big corporation. The company tried vainly to reduce costs by moving operations offshore. Even though we saved money in direct labor, we ended up adding cost by shipping, the time lag our money was tied up in containers, and we created non-value adding jobs to support offshore operations. When we looked at it from every angle, it was the organization that added costs, not the manufacturing operations. In every analysis I did, it was more cost effective to manufacture here in the US. We ended up with lower cost, and quality was significantly better. Quality was the one that surprised everyone, but in retrospect it made complete sense.

    If you manufacture a widget, you do internal monitoring and testing before you ship. But you can only test what you know will go wrong o what you think will could go wrong. But we're not psychics. Sometimes something slips through and becomes a problem "in the field." Now, if we're building it right here and the feedback comes back thatr w have an issue, we find the problem and fix it. But if we find the problem and it happened two months ago but it took us that long to get the product built overseas, shipped here, unshipped and distributed, I have two months of finished goods in the supply chain! Not good!

    So if I put on my shoes with tassles and think like a bean counter, (simplisticly) the reduction of direct labor costs makes offshore operations look good. But if I actually listen to the people who understand, there IS NO SAVINGS IN THE LONG RUN. And the higher volume the product, the hgher the automation, and the less direct labor, so eventually, there are only higher costs assocaited with offshore manufacturing as volumeincreases!

    So, it's not the people building things, it's the mindset of the guys on Mahogany Row that are increasing the cost of US goods.

    And from a macro view, it all comes down to common sense. You can't have a trade deficit and a healthy economy.

    China is the perfect example. We import more than weexport. We have a trade deficit, and as such, a tax deficit. So we borrow money from China to srvice the national debt. And in return, China gets to subsidize exports to the US giving them an unfair advantage in the markeplace...
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  6. #46
    Forum Member RocketMan's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Mgad, I'm piping in hear becasue I feel it is YOU that is making a grievous error in the perception of the spread of Asian rim manufacturing replacing ours. Please please please people, remember that China first and formost is a COMUNIST nation. At their core their leadrship not only does not adhier to our Western values for society, they absolutely hate us and intend to do us harm. The $$$s that are being funneled into their economy (and primaily their goverment) IS and WILL be used to further their aganeda. Liberal bedsetters and all you sexual intellectuals LISTEN-UP! At this point, not only are we tossing our manufacturing jobs and infrastructure, we are WAY behing the curve in percieving this growing and dangerous situation. We are litteraly "waking the sleepign dragon". And this quote comes not from me but from senior business associates in Korea who are a tad more faminliar with thier RED neighbor. We should not be planting more Wal-Marts we should by this point be pumping out tanks and such in large numbers lest our Chinese manufacturing partners WILL become our OverLords. And all quicker that you can imagine.
    I live with fear every day and on the weekends she lets me go racing..

  7. #47
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Maybe it makes some wealthier, but the people I know that have had their businesses ruined by offshore sourcing by their good customers. Chinese consumers can't afford western products, hell even many westerners can't afford them. And when 1000M Chinese all start driving cars around the greenhouse effect may make all this discussion moot. But I do take your point about fallacy of composition. Yeah, maybe I should see it differently but recently I saw a lot of disturbing stuff and it does tend to ruffle feathers. Lets digress back to pickups and guitars huh!!!

  8. #48
    Forum Member Kap'n's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Quote Originally Posted by RocketMan
    At their core their leadrship not only does not adhier to our Western values for society, they absolutely hate us and intend to do us harm.
    Some folks say that about Middle Eastern countries, too.

    I'm positive China and Middle Eastern countries say that about us too.

    Hell, I say that about my own government.
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  9. #49
    Forum Member Offshore Angler's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Kinman
    Lets digress back to pickups and guitars huh!!!
    No problemo!

    So, what's in the pipeline Chris? And I totally agree that it's just too confusing out there.

    Back to my view on all this - pups will make small changes, but a Strat through a Fender amp will sound like --- a Strat through a Fender amp. A Lester thought a Marshal will sound like what it is, and a Tele through a Dr. Z will sound - awesome. The pups are maybe the last 5% of the equation, but decent playing will overshadow that small contribution.

    The other part of this I struggle with is how we get so caught up in trying to recreate the vintage stuff, which was mostly pretty cheap stuff to begin with.

    My two main working guitars are a worthless Esquire clone, and a Strat+ with VN's. So, everything is totally wrong about my guitars anyway. I like em because they play great and stay in tune. I can deal with all the other issues (aka, the ubiquitous "tone" thing) via my amp and the sound system. Last time we played and people were mud-diving in front of the stage, I was musing about the whole tone deal while my guitar gently shreiked.
    "No harmonic knowledge, no sense of time, a ghastly tone, unskilled vibrato, and so on. Chuck is one of the worst guitar players I know" -Gravity Jim

  10. #50
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Quote Originally Posted by Tele-Bob
    It's funny how players get all on into this swapping and replacing and trying this and that, and then eventually, if they take their playing seriously enough over the years, end up with one or two preferences that really get the job done and they stop the modding and get on with the serious playing regardless of what their playing. This is not to say that modding a guitar is bad or wrong or has dubious politcal ramifications, it's just that it seems once a player reaches a certain point in their playing, the seem to concentrate more on making what they have work instead of looking for the answers in the latest, greatest gizmo just released from the Acme Answers Co.
    Kinda like life in general huh TB?? Some call it maturing.

    CT.:ahem

  11. #51
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Offshore Angler, I'm really glad to hear that at least some US manufacturers have/are still learning the often false economies of low-cost offshore sourcing. Your illustrations re time lag and quality issues, costs involved in logistics etc are heartwarming, but I'm afraid not enough people in the drivers seat understand or care what you have learned. If your experience was shared widespread why then does China have a BOOM economy and we in the west are all mostly the dooldrums? (dont answer that :) And the only profit increases of big corporations come from cost cutting and mass staff retrenchments...not efficiency or sales increases. It all comes back to spending patterns, consumers want cheaper prices and manufacturers have to provide or else the competition will. The race began years ago, the question is who are the real winners in the end? Not the consumers or the manufacturers I suspect. Ironic aint it? There are more ways to win a war than firing live ammunition.

    RocketMan, good on ya for expressing your views. I dont think alarm bells are ever a bad thing. Gotta keep people on their toes lest we lapse into complacency (which IS a VERY bad thing)

    Super Champ, your right of course, I admitted to digressing. But hell it was an interesting digression and one or two others thought so too. I'm done.

  12. #52
    Forum Member mgade's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Kinman
    Maybe it makes some wealthier, but the people I know that have had their businesses ruined by offshore sourcing by their good customers. Chinese consumers can't afford western products, hell even many westerners can't afford them. And when 1000M Chinese all start driving cars around the greenhouse effect may make all this discussion moot. But I do take your point about fallacy of composition. Yeah, maybe I should see it differently but recently I saw a lot of disturbing stuff and it does tend to ruffle feathers. Lets digress back to pickups and guitars huh!!!
    Give them time, and they will be craving vintage Fenders with genuine Kinman Pups. The people with the ruined business are just unfortunate. I pity them a lot, but there is no real answer but to start anew. Many people won't be able to do that. Sorry again.

    But I agree, back to guitars :)

    Quote Originally Posted by RocketMan
    Mgad, I'm piping in hear becasue I feel it is YOU that is making a grievous error in the perception of the spread of Asian rim manufacturing replacing ours. Please please please people, remember that China first and formost is a COMUNIST nation. At their core their leadrship not only does not adhier to our Western values for society, they absolutely hate us and intend to do us harm. The $$$s that are being funneled into their economy (and primaily their goverment) IS and WILL be used to further their aganeda. Liberal bedsetters and all you sexual intellectuals LISTEN-UP! At this point, not only are we tossing our manufacturing jobs and infrastructure, we are WAY behing the curve in percieving this growing and dangerous situation. We are litteraly "waking the sleepign dragon". And this quote comes not from me but from senior business associates in Korea who are a tad more faminliar with thier RED neighbor. We should not be planting more Wal-Marts we should by this point be pumping out tanks and such in large numbers lest our Chinese manufacturing partners WILL become our OverLords. And all quicker that you can imagine.
    I sorta both agree and disagree, but that is as far as I am following you out in that swamp. Could be fun, but this is not the place.

  13. #53
    Forum Member hudpucker's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Quote Originally Posted by CocoTone
    Kinda like life in general huh TB?? Some call it maturing.

    CT.:ahem

    Sounds more like two testimonials to me. I can name many players who are concerned about their gear who are also successful players of repute. Don't equate your own personal experiences as being indicative of some greater truism--there are simply too many examples to the contrary.
    Tone is in the fingers, eh? Let's hear your Vox, Marshall and Fender fingerings then...

  14. #54
    Forum Member Offshore Angler's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    As far as the vintage deal, it really is the quirkyness that we look for. I've played many an aftermarket pup that sounded great. Great all the time, and great everywhere on the neck. And therin lies the problem. I really like a guitar that does something a little different as it reponds to playing. It adds a nice dynamic to the playing.

    The vintage stuff that I like is generally the ones that have personality. Perhaps one pole peice has aged differently than the others. Maybe it was built that way. But character comes from inperfections. Some of the aftermarkets seem just a little too well behaved for live playing. I've read how many companies have tried to get rid of the "problems" inherent to certain pup types. Well, I dig some of the problems! Being well-behaved and totally predictable is so NOT Rock and Roll!

    But then I think of a guy like Chris, and understand consistensy is exactly what he sells. But as far as the quirks, yo can leave them in the design and we'll be very happy, Thank You very much. In fact, that's why I settled on the VN's in my Stratocaster. They somehow remained unsophisticated enough to sound good.
    "No harmonic knowledge, no sense of time, a ghastly tone, unskilled vibrato, and so on. Chuck is one of the worst guitar players I know" -Gravity Jim

  15. #55
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Well the way I see it, the Mexican pickups don't sound bad, but they have a big string-to-string balance problem. They taper the ceramic magnets to fit the contour radius of a neck. Unfortunately, it’s usually not contoured to match the radius of the neck of the guitar they are put in.

    Basically, if you set your string height by the high and low E, your middle strings are way too hot, and if you set by the middle stings, your high and low E are too quiet. I'm not sure if staggered pole pieces are that much better, but they seem to be.

    One of the Strats I saw in China had staggered ceramic pickups. That would have been interesting to see how that one sounded. If it got rid of the string-to-string balance problems MiM ceramics are know for.
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Quote Originally Posted by hudpucker
    Sounds more like two testimonials to me. I can name many players who are concerned about their gear who are also successful players of repute. Don't equate your own personal experiences as being indicative of some greater truism--there are simply too many examples to the contrary.
    Could`ve worn I used the term `in general`,,,I`m only speaking from my own experiences. Like someone else said, in another thread maybe,, a good player can make anything sound good.

    CT.:ahem

  17. #57
    Forum Member Tele-Bob's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Is it time again for us to all start harassing Chris about a noiseless P90?

    We haven't forgotten Chris! Every time I see a sweet Warmoth body routed out for P90's I am reminded of how much I'd like to have a good noiseless set.
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  18. #58
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    whole lotta stuff to read here...

    but for example my case:

    I'm a tall guy with long fingers/big hands. that's why I like fatter necks. for my style of playing I prefer medium jumbos. I like natural necks 'cos my hands tend to sweat when playing guitar. I don't like the single coil humming so I'll go with some noiseless ones.

    So now you tell me which Strat to buy in the FIRST place that can get that job better done than a Mexican JV with the pups I like...?!

    secong example:
    got myself a faded SG. Swapped pups for mod fun to 4 conductors to get the buckers splitted 'cos I always thought SGs were capable of more sounds than most players use her for. Greatest idea ever for me! Two simple coil taps and I can get a least 10 times more sounds out of her sometimes even Stratlike to a certain extend... I loved the mod so much I'm considering a Jimmy Page wiring mod. my question: where to get a SG like that?

  19. #59
    Forum Member Offshore Angler's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Quote Originally Posted by photoweborama
    Well the way I see it, the Mexican pickups don't sound bad, but they have a big string-to-string balance problem. They taper the ceramic magnets to fit the contour radius of a neck. Unfortunately, it’s usually not contoured to match the radius of the neck of the guitar they are put in.
    Phtot, old buddy, you're thinking too linear! OK, I will now share a secret of mine that I figured out a while back.

    Vintage pups were built for a smaller neck radius. So, when you put them in a modern axe, the middle poles are too high. So right there is the secret to the vintage pup sound.

    You raise the treble side, lower the bass and you get great balance from the strings excpet the really low end. And guess what, live, playing rock ( in the single coil way - not grungy or crunchy) low end is in the way! And hence, you get that great Strat cutting tone through the PA.

    There, the cat's out of the bag. I'm probably going to be asked to hand in my Spandex and wig now.
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  20. #60
    Forum Member RocketMan's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Could be fun, but this is not the place.
    Mgad;
    I agree.
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  21. #61
    Forum Member thetallcoolone's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Now that we're back onto MIM pups may I ask a few questions?

    I'm no tech expert in guitars, hell I know very little on the tech used for guitars. From what I remember from my youth days when I look a bit into pups, every pole piece was made of magnetic material and then you had a coil around them.

    When I bought my MIM in 2001, the pups that were in there (the 2 singles, I have a HSS Strat) had 2 little magnetic bars and the pole pieces were made of regular metal. (they were not magnetic)

    Now, I don't really know but too me this is not the ideal pup setup, is it?
    According the tech at the reseller I got my Strat from, this was where Fender cut corners to lower the price of their MIM guitars. (and most likely the rest of the electronics too)

    Can somebody tell me if these original pups I had are standard pups config or were they really a cheap alternative?
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  22. #62
    Forum Member NeoFauve's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    OA- Imperfections and problems are in my fingers!
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  23. #63
    Forum Member Marcondo's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Sounds like ceramic magnets which are cheaper than alnico to make.

  24. #64
    Forum Member Offshore Angler's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Quote Originally Posted by NeoFauve
    OA- Imperfections and problems are in my fingers!
    He, he! Last job we did my pedalboard got soaked, and my Suck button must've broke, cause I played pretty good!
    "No harmonic knowledge, no sense of time, a ghastly tone, unskilled vibrato, and so on. Chuck is one of the worst guitar players I know" -Gravity Jim

  25. #65
    Forum Member Tele-Bob's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Quote Originally Posted by cross
    whole lotta stuff to read here...

    secong example:
    got myself a faded SG. Swapped pups for mod fun to 4 conductors to get the buckers splitted 'cos I always thought SGs were capable of more sounds than most players use her for. Greatest idea ever for me! Two simple coil taps and I can get a least 10 times more sounds out of her sometimes even Stratlike to a certain extend... I loved the mod so much I'm considering a Jimmy Page wiring mod. my question: where to get a SG like that?
    This always amuses me. I have had guitars with split coils in the past and for the life of me, I have never found a use for that sound. In fact no one I know has ever used that split coild sound. They all have it, but no one uses it. At least on a gig anyway. No offense man, but your post made me think about this. I don't know anyone who actually uses that sound. Crazy.
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  26. #66
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Quote Originally Posted by Marcondo
    Sounds like ceramic magnets which are cheaper than alnico to make.
    So, if I understand correctly, ceramic pups are made of 2 strips of magnetic metal and the pole pieces are of regular metal (which is the ceramic part?)
    And AlniCO pups are made with magnetic pole pieces.

    This might be simplistic to the max but am I in the right direction?
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  27. #67
    Forum Member Kap'n's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    "Ceramic" and "Alnico" are two different types of magnets.


    Alnico is an alloy of three metals, Aluminum, Nickel and Cobalt, hence the name. Nickel and Cobalt being two of the three magnetic elements. Iron would be the third. Alnico has the advantage of being relaitvely lightweight fo a given magnetic strength. Another property Alnico has is that it can be temporarily demagentized by strong magnetic fields, but snaps back. This is important for speakers, because it results in some of the compression you hear with an alnico speaker. I'm sure CK could tell you more about its application in pickups. Alnico magnets can only be made in a few shapes. Nickel and cobalt are relatively expensive metals.

    Ceramic magnets are made with magnetic particles (iron?) suspended it a matrix of, you guessed it, ceramic. Because it's ceramic, it can be molded into any number of shapes, and is inexpensive to produce. Because it's inexpensive, and more stable in application than Alnico, it replaced Alnico for many applications.
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    mercy! all these replies and no answers. i am not asking what is "better" just what is? if mr. kinman is as confused as i am then i should not me suprised this thread ending up being the slow boat to china so to speak.

  29. #69
    Forum Member Marcondo's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Fender doesnt release any specs on the MIM pickups because they dont sell them seperatly. I can get you dc resistance hernies and magnet type and wire used on the 57/62ri CS69 Fat 50's Nocaster and a few others which specs are published but they dont tell anything about the MIM versions.

  30. #70
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Kap'n, cool info, thanks.
    That cleared up the ALniCo vs ceramic dlilema.

    But what about the actual construction of the pup (single coil)?
    I gather that the pole pieces are to be the magnetized parts and, according your explaination, they are to be either ceramic or ALniCO.
    (Damn I'm bright, hey? )

    Just about every pups I've seen (not that many actually) were made with the pole pieces being magnetized and the wiring coiled around them.
    On the ones that came with my MIM HSS Strat, they were made differently.
    The pole pieces were not of magnetized material. Only the two metal bars on each sides were. The coil was below the bars.

    I'm just wondering if these original pups were normal quality pups or if they were of the cheapest quality to reduce the cost of the guitar.
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  31. #71
    Forum Member Kap'n's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Quote Originally Posted by thetallcoolone
    But what about the actual construction of the pup (single coil)?
    I gather that the pole pieces are to be the magnetized parts and, according your explaination, they are to be either ceramic or ALniCO..
    Virtually no ceramic pickups exist, where the magnets themselves are inside the coil. I think the sole excetion to that is the old Fender/Seth Lover humbucker.

    On a typical Fender single coil, the rods are actual magnets. Strictly speaking, they're not "pole pieces." I believe a pole piece is a non-magnetic piece of steel 'loaded' by a magnet.

    Cheaper Fender-style pickups have steel polepieces, loaded by a ceramic bar magnet on the bottom.

    On a traditional humbucker, there's a single bar magnet that loads both rows of polepieces, one side north, the other south. That bar magnet is either ceramic or alnico.

    P-90's have true pole pieces, and are loaded by two bar magnets, either alnico or ceramic.
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  32. #72
    Forum Member Constellation80's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    you guys might for asking this. But
    Why is it Fender and Gibson pickups have the most after market pickup clones? Why hasn't there been any drastically new desighns?
    I have a 1959 Harmony Stratotone jupiter. That I find sounds better then even my gibson sometimes. Why aren't cool guitars like this not modernised into new equally cool guitars?
    My friend once told me you will know the differnce of sound quality through a good amp. IF your using a cheapo 15w A gibson gonna sound the same as a squier. I belive he's right, I couldn't tell the differnce till I got my hrdx. Now when I plug cheaper guitars I notice the differnce right away (maybe i have trained my ear?)
    and one last point i have to make (thats if your still bothering to read this haha) Harmony Guitars in the 1960's had more orders then they could fill. they had 2 options to build a bigger plant, or outsource there guitars. They choice to outsource to Japan. They essencially let the japanese into the americain market, and with in 5 years by the 70's the Japanese had put Harmony out of buisness. The factory closed people lost there jobs. I've noticed the prices on korean and chinese guitars creeping up slowly. So im saying whats the point of buying a koriean for 1000 bucks when you can support US for 1300 ang get a much nicer guitar

  33. #73
    Forum Member Kap'n's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Quote Originally Posted by Tele-Bob
    This always amuses me. I have had guitars with split coils in the past and for the life of me, I have never found a use for that sound. In fact no one I know has ever used that split coild sound. They all have it, but no one uses it.
    A split coil JB sounds decent in the bridge position, when it's mixed with the middle to get a bit of quack. Otherwise lame.
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  34. #74
    Forum Member Kap'n's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Quote Originally Posted by Constellation80
    you guys might for asking this. But
    Why is it Fender and Gibson pickups have the most after market pickup clones?
    Because 90+% of all electric guitars out there use Strat-style or Gibson humbucker style pickups. There's not a lot of market for, for example, a lipstick tube pickup designed to fit a Jaguar.

    Back before the advent of the clones in the early-mid 70's, most guitar manufacturers used proprietary pickup designs. During the 70's, everybody wanted what the GUITAR HEROES used, hence the clones, and the universal design. Dimarzio comes out with the Super Distortion pickup, and the rest is history.
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  35. #75
    Forum Member chuckocaster's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    the reason is man is because people are so hooked on having a lester or tele or strat etc. it's an iconic status symbol. no offense to the LPF, but i can barely read it at times because of this.

    there have been attempts at producing stuff like that, but it never really sells enough to make a big dent in the guitar buisness. sad to say cause a lot of that "junk" stuff is freakin awesome. i had a teisco with a microphone for a pup, and it freakin rocked. like no other tone i've heard. but do you think it's going to sell enough? not hardly.

    that's really the reason i build and modify my guitars. because i cannot buy them like the way i want them. and if i ordered them from someone the price would be outrageous. people are scared of stuff that is "different". look in some history books at all the wars, deaths, persecutions, exiles, etc. they've all pretty much taken place because people were scared of differences. so sad to see.

    i digress...

    i swap pups for me, not the audience. granted it is always such a little change that most the time others can't tell the difference. but on my sg and jazzmaster, it made all the difference in the world. lesters and strats, whatever. i love those guitars, but they don't really excite me too much. i like the more "non standard" stuff.

    and for pups, sorry to say but i do have a preference. and i know it when i hear it. and most of the time, it ain't with a standard off the machine winder. sorry, but i like the handbuilt stuff. it has character, and ain't as pretty lookin.
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  36. #76
    Forum Member grito's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    I lost track on where this thread was heading, but here's my personal take:

    When I went shopping for a strat, I went through the shops ENTIRE stock. Took my own personal amp in for the final showdown between three that I thought knocked me out. Ending up buying a nice sunburst strat.

    I was recording quiet a bit so I installed some EMG pups. I know, I'm a sucker for those things. I was also into a "humbucker in the neck" thing so it was kinda cool. Missed the strat sound I had heard when I bought the strat, so I went for a more traditional tone: the EMG-DG.

    Nah, still not there. Plus I got tired of changing out the battery. I thought, hey, I like the Clapton strat sound. I bought a set of Lace pups and tried that for a while. Nope, still not there.

    Then I heard of some nice things about the Tex Tone pups, if that's the right name. Hmm, not my thing.

    Going through some boxes I find the original pups that where in the guitar. Blam! It was love at first strum. It was the sound that made me buy the guitar in the first place. I had my tech rewire the guard to reduce the hum (I don't know what he did to be frank). So there it was: the shitty Delta-Tone pups where the sland.

    My point is that there are too many variances that make a guitar sing to you. Shitty pup might be PERFECT in that certain guitar. Who knows...
    "Power don't come from a badge or a gun. Power comes from lying. Lying big and gettin' the whole damn world to play along with you. Once you've got everybody agreeing with what they know in their hearts ain't true, you've got 'em by the balls."
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  37. #77
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Quote Originally Posted by Tele-Bob
    This always amuses me. I have had guitars with split coils in the past and for the life of me, I have never found a use for that sound. In fact no one I know has ever used that split coild sound. They all have it, but no one uses it. At least on a gig anyway. No offense man, but your post made me think about this. I don't know anyone who actually uses that sound. Crazy.
    well the point is.... I do use it. Don't know why I shouldn't it adds a whole lot of nouances to the tone. The neck bucker with the bridge split gives some more trebble shimmer etc... since I've those split options installed I haven't used the knobs on my amp or equipment as often as I used to. It's no 'REAL' SC sound no doubt but I love messing around with it 'cos I love finding new tone n don't care too much about 'The Tone Of My Heroes' like many do. 'Oh damn that doesn't sound vintage!' 'Nah that ain't like a Strat's supposed to sound.' whatever. I don't know how you guys think about it but certain tones inspires me to play different stuff as well as adjusting the tone to my favors n that's why I love versatile guitars+'senseless' gimmiks, good pots etc...
    maby that will change when I get older and I just want a real simple sound... but who knows... I guess that's what everyone going through... :blbros

  38. #78
    Forum Member Tele-Bob's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    The Tex Mex p'ups that came in my, (are you sitting down?), $150, Fender 50th Anniversary, Tex Mex Strat sounded amazing at lower volume levels. But in a club they just didn't get it done. I had a set of Robert Cray Custom Shop p'ups that I dropped in and it transformed the guitar.

    Cheap p'ups just don't sound that good when the volume gets loud. A great set of p'ups is judged on the sounds they pick up from the guitar. They should also be judged on some of the sounds that get left out. Crank up a Squier sometime, real loud, and you'll hear what I mean.
    If you're bored, you're not groovin'.

  39. #79

    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    Quote Originally Posted by Tele-Bob
    This always amuses me. I have had guitars with split coils in the past and for the life of me, I have never found a use for that sound. In fact no one I know has ever used that split coild sound. They all have it, but no one uses it. At least on a gig anyway. No offense man, but your post made me think about this. I don't know anyone who actually uses that sound. Crazy.
    TB, I have never had a use nor cared for that "split humbucker tone" either. Having said that, however, I have seen Robben Ford do some amazing things (and get some righteous tones) from a split coil equipped Baker (which was similar to his Fender signature model).
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  40. #80
    Forum Member Tele-Bob's Avatar
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    Re: the real truth about mexican pickups

    You could count the extremely rare cases on one hand where people have actually used that sound so some advantage, and most of those times were probably in the recording studio. :ahem
    !
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