Question about Nash guitars

**Bill Barnard** · 03-10-2005, 01:18 PM

Okay, I'm posting my early impressions and I'll tell you that I have a couple issues with the guitar and am waiting to hear from Bill Nash on them.

It is hard to give you a really accurate review because I haven't been able to play it completely enough to really do a full review. Why? Because I've got some fret buzz/fretting out on the high and low E strings. I originally thought it was due to the difference in temp/humidity between here (Florida) and Washington (State) and that the guitar would just need a set up/truss rod adjustment. That turns out to perhaps not be the case. In looking further at the saddles the adjustment screws on the high E string are actually screwed down all the way through and the high E saddle is actually resting on the screw it isn't in the hole. You can actually see the tip of a pen through the hole if you put it under the edge of the saddle. A longer screw(s) is going to be required for those two saddles minimum.

Here's the early (less than 2 hours playing time) remaining impressions:

The neck. Always the most important component for me. Not as big as I thought it would be. At least that was my initial impression. That said, when I actually took out my LP Gem and then played them both, the Strat neck is pretty full feeling. I think it will be fine but not as "beefy" as I thought it would be. It does have a nice smooth played in feeling without stickiness. To me, it appears that the neck has what I’d call a “reverse” profile. By that I mean it is thicker (back to front) up by the nut and slightly thinner (but wider) down near the body (again back to front, i.e., from the front of the fretboard to the back of the neck). Every other guitar I own is the reverse of that (thinner near the nut with some small but progressive thickening towards the body, again back to front, not side to side). One of the reasons I specified the thickness contour for my neck is because I have been prone to getting thumb pain when I hook the thumb over to bend notes which causes the thumb tendon to rub on the edge of the neck if not large enough to change where that intersection is. The thickness is perfect up near the nut and I think I may be able to play it fine without thumb joint pain further up since it is wider, but I want someone else to play it and tell me if they think I'm just seeing/feeling things.

Resonance. The guitar is VERY resonant. Sounds really good. A little brighter than I thought it would be when compared to the Grosh (with similar pickups). Not necessarily a bad thing just different. I'm really happy with how the low E sounds (in the areas where it can be played). On most Strats I've had the low E didn't have that nice articulate but low sound to it that some classic old strats have. This one has it.

Frets. Plus and minus here. I LOVE the 6150s that I got. My Grosh had 6105s which are tall and narrower. These are much more like the Fender medium jumbos or the frets on the Gem. That said the finish work isn't up to the Grosh (but not many are). Grosh actually rounds the ends of his frets and they are very polished.

Blend control. Works okay but not as much change as the blend control on the Grosh. The master treble is probably MORE responsive than the Grosh so there is some balance there.

Color. Perfect. Not too dark not too light

Finish. Flat. You know even on an "under the bed" guitar (which is what I ordered) I'd expect to see some "glossy" finish areas. This is pretty flat finished. Think kinda "Highway 1" flat but better than that.

Fit. Hmmm. I don't know whether or not I'm just being picky or not but two small things bother me. First the B and A strings don't cross exactly in the center of the 12th fret dots. In addition, on only the bridge pickup the high E string magnet doesn't fall right under the string. Probably not a big issue.

Weight. Pretty light. Not extra extra light but a nice light weight to it.

Couple of other things. First, is that the screws that attach the neck to the body have tops that are rough and were actually picking my pants. For an under the bed for 40 years guitar, I don't think anyone would have taken the neck on and off so much that they would have "roughed" the tops of the screws like that.

Finally Bill Nash initialed and dated the guitar on the back of the headstock....with a SHARPIE! I don't mind him taking credit for his work (the headstock logo is a Nash one) but he could have stamped the neck plate with his logo and date. I'd have been fine with that. Or sign it under the pickguard. But not the back of the headstock.

I have an email into him discussing these things. The only game breaker is the saddles. And unless I find the neck size/shape bothering me, the rest I can live with. The guitar is really resonant when played acoustically and I think would be great if these things are fixed.

I'll keep you posted on what happens.

**Brassnut** · 03-10-2005, 03:01 PM

Originally Posted by Bill Barnard

Because I've got some fret buzz/fretting out on the high and low E strings. I originally thought it was due to the difference in temp/humidity between here (Florida) and Washington (State)

Those places are BOTH pretty humid.

In looking further at the saddles the adjustment screws on the high E string are actually screwed down all the way through and the high E saddle is actually resting on the screw it isn't in the hole.

That is caused from either a too shallow (thin) neck or a too deep neck pocket on the body. or some mismatch combination of both. It may be from mixing metric and SAE standard sizes. The proper fix for that is to route off 1-16th (+ -) from the surface of the neck pocket. Longer screws is not the cure and will kill your sustain. Seymour Duncan DEEPENS all his Tele neck pockets so that the saddles are as close to the bridge plane as posseible. Now on a vintage guitar this removes the date stamps or whatever but makes for a better player.

the B and A strings don't cross exactly in the center of the 12th fret dots.

NO big deal. Cosmetic issue only and affects nothing.

In addition, on only the bridge pickup the high E string magnet doesn't fall right under the string. Probably not a big issue.

MUCH bigger deal. Also the distance from the edge of the high E to the neck edge. Some Strats of the 70's had the high E falling off the edge. Again some mismatch in spacing and / or pickguard due to the mixing of parts manufactures. The low E may not be over the neck pickup either. This is why "parts guitars" have problems. All of ONE company fits OK all of the other company fits too. When you buy stuff on sale from randon companies you get an oddball fit.

the screws that attach the neck to the body have tops that are rough and were actually picking my pants.

POWER TOOLS. That black and decker power screwdriver is great for home projects but shoud be kept far away from guitars. Of course who has time for quality when you have 10 guitars to build and 12 more orders.

This shot shot alone represents 10 guitars at what, 1500 each? around 15 THOUSAND DOLLARS in 2 months?! minus parts layout and you have a 10,000 profit.

Like I said, this guy is a fucking BUSINESS and BULLSHIT GENIUS and has the best racket in town period. In one pic on his site I counted 33 necks and over 22 bodies laying around. :bwa

He quit his $120,000+ year job to do this full time. If I could stay home and screw together 500. parts guitars, slap a fake fender decal on it and make a 1,000 profit off each one, I damm sure would be kissing EVERYONES ASS on every web forum out there too.

How in the world can this guy be a sponsor of "that other forum" and get away with making fake fenders with the decals right there in front of everyone? The guys got some balls.

**Bill Barnard** · 03-10-2005, 03:30 PM

Originally Posted by Brassnut

That is caused from either a too shallow (thin) neck or a too deep neck pocket on the body. or some mismatch combination of both. It may be from mixing metric and SAE standard sizes. The proper fix for that is to route off 1-16th (+ -) from the surface of the neck pocket. Longer screws is not the cure and will kill your sustain. Seymour Duncan DEEPENS all his Tele neck pockets so that the saddles are as close to the bridge plane as posseible. Now on a vintage guitar this removes the date stamps or whatever but makes for a better player.

No it's the screws. The saddle right next to it sits only slightly higher and still has the adjustment screws sticking up above the saddle.

Originally Posted by Brassnut

MUCH bigger deal. Also the distance from the edge of the high E to the neck edge. Some Strats of the 70's had the high E falling off the edge. Again some mismatch in spacing and / or pickguard due to the mixing of parts manufactures. The low E may not be over the neck pickup either. This is why "parts guitars" have problems. All of ONE company fits OK all of the other company fits too. When you buy stuff on sale from randon companies you get an oddball fit.

The string is straight down the neck and not falling off. It is only over the high E bridge pickup. All other magnets/strings line up.

Originally Posted by Brassnut

This shot shot alone represents 10 guitars at what, 1500 each? around 15 THOUSAND DOLLARS in 2 months?!

Time to complete is running right at 4 months.

Originally Posted by Brassnut

He quit his $120,000+ year job to do this full time. If I could stay home and screw together 500. parts guitars, slap a fake fender decal on it and make a 1,000 profit off each one, I damm sure would be kissing EVERYONES ASS on every web forum out there too.

Nothing is stopping you. If you've got the skills go for it. I don't and so I chose someone to do it for me. If I'd chosen the Custom Shop the wait would have been 3-4 times as long and the price would be almost the same mulitiplier, because I'd have to have gone Masterbuilt to get what I wanted. With no more guarantee of quality from what I've seen.

Originally Posted by Brassnut

How in the world can this guy be a sponsor of "that other forum" and get away with making fake fenders with the decals right there in front of everyone? The guys got some balls.

My guitar does NOT (for like the hundredth time) have a Fender decal. It has a NASH decal.

**Relicula** · 03-10-2005, 04:07 PM

I wonder what it cost Lentz,Suhr, or Fender to produce a strat? I sure as hell know what it cost to buy one. The fact that you dont like relics in general, or vintage dealers, or much of anything except your 71 tele, says it all. Why must you dump on us that have a desire to own one of these, its not costing you anything is it?

You want to talk about bullshit genius, how about a nice Tom Delonge strat? or one of the countless other signature models pedalled to players who think they will sound just like SRV if they have one of his siggy models. In fact the damn SRV looks nothing like the real #1 at all.

I have 14 guitars, cant relic them myself, I play at least one everyday. I like the feel, and look of an old guitar, and cant find myself forking over stupid money for just one. I just saw an auction end for a 75-76 strat for 3903! Want to talk profit, and bullshit genius, that guitar sold for 279 dollars. It sure as hell doesnt sound any better today than it did the day after Fender dripped all the poly goo on the neck and body. Quite honestly, and I wont diss your 71 tele, its yours you like it, and I am fine with that. But the 70's arent known to be Fender flagship years for quality right? But there are quite a few people out there buying up these guitars at astronomical prices, especially when you consider the tone and quality of most of them. If anything is bullshit genius its the guys selling those

**Brassnut** · 03-23-2005, 08:19 PM

SOB!

I went into a local shop and SAW and PLAYED a NASH Strat today on the way home. It was a Rosewood 1962 Fiesta Red. I'll write more later, but here are some quick thoughts.

It did look good from across the room...gotta fess up. It looked even better in the pics. They guy had an ebay print out for the auction. He paid 1150 for it. But up close it was very rough and sloppy. The pickguard was airbrushed green then brown and sanded down with a rough paper. It looked like a 15 year old did it. The body was nitro but had no primer or filler ? and big seams of wood grain all over that you could feel. He missed places with the third color of suinburst and covered it over with the air brushing.

The knobs were all three different and sprayed with light brown. It looks like you took a regular strat and air brushed wear dirt and all over the guitar and on the neck.

The guitar played fine (G string was a little low / I'll get to that) and sounded fine too. Overall yea it was a decent parts guitar bu The rear of the neck had very thick paint and airbrushing phoney wear UNDER the clear. There was also a hand mark or finger print that wiped away the airbrushing and it was under the clear. All the metal even the input jack was solid rust and the repair guy fumed about trying to adjust the saddles. He said broke off three height screws and gave up. The asking price was 850.

**Joe Ganzler** · 03-24-2005, 08:23 AM

Originally Posted by Spose

I just hate when that argument is brought into these discussions.

The cost of materials has nothing to do with the selling price of a piece. Scott Lentz has spent years..decades honing his craft and skills. How much is THAT worth. You wouldn't ask how much the materials cost for a Picasso...then expect to pay slightly over that. Over materials..you are paying for the name.
What's in a name?
Everything.
That name has invested a lifetime in creating some of the best world class guitars known. When you buy a Fender, Gibson or Martin..you are paying for decades (in the case of Martin, over a century) of experience and dedication to the craft. Not to mention..the costs involved running a HUGE corporation. These are all factored in to the costs....not just the actual materials. There are all kinds of hidden costs running a business.

How much does the Dr. pay for the bandage he put on your arm? How much did he charge you?
same idea...your paying for the expertise.
How much did that plumber charge you for coming to your house and putting in a new kitchen faucet? You know the materials didn't cost but 10 or 20% of the bill. RIP OFF??..I don't think so.

In the case of up and coming builders who have yet to make a name for themselves....well, that's part of the process. They have to build a reputation, which takes years and years. Lentz has EARNED his rep and the money his guitars bring...there's no arguing that fact.
These guitars..like anything else in the retail world..bring what the market will bare. If you buy a quality piece from a well known name that has earned the reputation..chances are it will at least hold it's value..and in some cases be worth more then original purchase price.

Fuckin'-A Right!! :ahem

**Marcondo** · 03-24-2005, 12:49 PM

Brassnut I like U for 1 simple reason.

You tell the truth.

**coldshot3** · 03-25-2005, 06:51 AM

I really dig my Nash. I have been playing for over 25 years and my Nash ,sonically,kills any S -Style guitar I have ever owned. The relicing/aging thing is a different argument. Some folks like it.some do not. I have had to pleasure to play/own several vintage fenders.Soundwise the Nash's rate favorably, factor in a more playable 12 radius and I have everything I've always wanted in a strat. Vintage vibe-modern playability. I swore off Fenders for years. I was so underwhelmed/disappointed by a bone stock 73 Strat that was quite frankly a squealin',untunable,lifeless piece piece of junk. I took this guitar to some of the finest luthiers in the area in the hope of salvaging it. This guitar bore no resemblance to a good friends 67 Strat. Early 71-73 Fenders are generally regarded as a low point for Fender..I can personally attest.I compare my Nash to friend's 57 Strat and a bud's 55 Esquire. These guitars resonate so well and sound great. Relicing aside..personal taste..Nash guitars play and sound great. Buying a guitar,built to personal specs, without really "trying" it is a tough thing. You are bound to experience some pitfalls.

**Brassnut** · 03-25-2005, 07:20 AM

Originally Posted by Relicula

I wonder what it cost Lentz,Suhr, or Fender to produce a strat? I sure as hell know what it cost to buy one.

That would be funny if the parts make up of a Dumble Super Overdrive head were only 200 dollars more that the parts in a Hot Rod Deville.

Heck, I hear the human body contains only 75 cents worth of minerals.

**Relicula** · 03-25-2005, 10:03 AM

I dont really give a shit about Scott Lentz's years of experience or overhead, this is a thread about Nash guitars period. Start a thread about Lentz, if you care to, I promise I wont go there and piss all over it like some of you have here. Dont like Nash', or the relic concept, its fine with me. Dont buy one.
I dont have to justify how I spend my money, and to quote the bullshit genius line from my friend Brassnut, look at the prices of 70's Fenders, the bullshit genius will be staring you right in the face.

All I wanted to do here is exchange info with people who have a common interest in this item, nothing more.

**detuned** · 03-25-2005, 10:57 AM

It's not the relic concept for me, or even the idea that he's taking Warmouth &other parts & screwing together.

It's that Fender decal I saw above. Not cool.

Sorry if you disagree.

**Relicula** · 03-25-2005, 11:27 AM

That Fender decal was mine, Bill had nothing to do with it. Its my guitar, my choice. I was trying to recreate a guitar with the looks of something vintage. And vintage Fender at that. My thought after owning countless Fender's over the years, was to describe what I wanted to a builder, and copy it.

I know its not a fender, nor when the time comes to sell, (which I sell everything sooner or later) I wont advertise it as one. All you have to do is look close at the decal, no pat.pend #'s etc. So its an easy give away, if you looked closely.

That would be funny if the parts make up of a Dumble Super Overdrive head were only 200 dollars more that the parts in a Hot Rod Deville.

Brass, you couldnt pick to further ends of the spectrum to make your point could you? A dumble, and a hot rod deville, how bout a real 59 Les Paul, and an Epiphone, I heard that the bang for your buck is so good that no one should even contemplate buying the real deal. , let alone one of those overpriced reissue r9's, bring that argument over to the other side at the LPF, if you want to.

I'm done with this thread, thank you boys for all your wisdom.

**detuned** · 03-25-2005, 02:04 PM

Geez. Touchy.

:-/

**CocoTone** · 03-26-2005, 06:11 AM

Bill, I got curious when ypou mentioned he high E string not lining up exactly with the pole magnet on the bribge pickup. I looked at my AM reissue Strat, and its the same. Its offset slightly south of the pole, but it doesn`t seem to effect the tone much, if at all. All in all it soulds like a nice players guitar, once you get it sorted out to your satisfaction.

CT.:ahem

**Brassnut** · 03-26-2005, 07:07 AM

Originally Posted by BrassNut

That would be funny if the parts make up of a Dumble Super Overdrive head weren't only 200 dollars more that the parts in a Hot Rod Deville.

Originally Posted by Relicula

Brass, you couldnt pick to further ends of the spectrum to make your point could you? (A dumble, vs. a hot rod deville)

Psssssssst that was called "MAKING A POINT" -try it sometime.

Reminds me of Jr. High when we told little Tommy the cute cheerleader likes him and he should go kiss her...before boarding the short bus.

**Nashguitars** · 03-27-2005, 05:52 PM

Hello from BN at Nashguitars. (sorry this is long....)
I appreciate all the postings on my stuff. I do want to clarify a few things.
I am using US made Fender licensed necks and bodies and have been through much legal stuff that could eat up a whole forum. Bottom line is that the big F people seem to be leaving me alone as the legalities seem to rest on my side. If I were making my own necks and bodies, thus NOT paying the license fees, the F men may have a case.
Yes, I do not do very well at returning phone calls, in fact I only return phone calls to current clients or if there is an emergencey. I have yet to witness a guitar emergency. It can also take several days to return email as I get about 40 per day, this is after deleting the ads for Viagra, Mortgages and some foriegn guy who has 338,997.00 for me, if only I devulge my banking info. I have two part time employees with a third coming aboard this week. I do not wish to exapand as I think it is important to have my hands do 90% of the work on each guitar. I only employ people who are as passionate about guitars as I am. I could expand, hire a bunch of non-gear heads and really crank 'em out, but what would be the point of that. I hope that I will be better at communication once this third employee is brought up to speed.
I am not really sure what unhappiness "Brassnut" must endure during the course of his day to have him seem rather inapropriately resentful of someone he has never met, done biz with or whatever. If he hates his current job, maybe he should build guitars. There is plenty of work in the boutique guitar biz to support many more of us and perhaps he would be happier. He seems to have spent a long time analizing my numbers and biz model, and though he is off on some things he seems to have some aptitude.
As a small biz, if I did not take a deposit I would be crazy. I have 126 guitars on order - do the math on the initial outlay for parts. As far as cranking them out to Japan, blah, blah....(xenophobic?) I do a limited number of dealer orders per month so I can maintain the quality for all. I am no where meeting the demand of US and Foriegn dealers for my stuff, but I am steadfast in keeping the output levels low so every guitar is special. I could switch over to only dealer orders and make a fine living.
About once a month, I feel overwhelmed and tell my wife that I am no longer going to take any custom orders, just build guitars and sell them on my site and to dealers, thus circumventing most of the phone and email pressure, however, she always reminds me that I got into this to be of service to fellow players who are looking for something created especially for them. Something that will give them an instrument that has a magic not available "off the rack". I will to continue to do this even though I am busier than I would like to be sometimes.
Some other points: Most guitarists are collectors and gear junkies. I have never stated that buying one of my guitars will cure this, or that my guitars are so fab that you won't want 2 dozen other guitars. There are so many great guitars available on the market that I am grateful for all the choices. Lollar, Lull, Callaham, Suhr, Florence etc - there are some great custom guitars out there! I am also grateful that many people consider one of mine as one of their choices. The world could easily live without my stuff. Guitars are 100% guaranteed. Full refund - No questions asked. No one should ever have an ax they do not bond with.
I hope that everyone finds whatever makes them happy in a guitar, if it is one of mine or not.

BN

"Can't we all just get along"
- R. King, Indy Driver, Urban Legend, Crack Head

**Nashguitars** · 03-28-2005, 01:41 AM

After reading through a few more postings by Brassnut, I just can't imagine what I ever did to upset this guy.....

Brassnut does not accept email from Forum Members so I have to do this here:

If we have some history that has caused such resentment, let me know. I'd be more than happy to discuss whatever seems to be eating you. Why on earth would you take so much time posting negative stuff about someone. I just do not get it. Did I run over your cat when I was in Tennessee? Does it upset you to see someone making a living doing what they love? Are you the guy who sends me hate email? What would it take to make you happy? Want to move to Olympia WA and work with me? Are you a generally unhappy person? Can I send you some spiritual books or help with cost of counselling? Maybe you need AA?
Whatever the case, why don't you spend some of this energy in a more positive way and leave me and my clients alone. If you don't like my guitars, don't buy one. If you have not owned one, please keep your opinions to yourself. You may say that these forums are for anyone to post any opinion, however, there are libel laws that superceed any terms of public forums, so tread lightly......

**Brassnut** · 03-28-2005, 05:08 AM

Originally Posted by Zoso

I have been unable to get ahold of him since. I'm a bit leery of giving my money to somebody I can't get ahold of when I'm trying to give him money. Anyone have experience dealing with him? Thoughts?