Fret Buzz past 14th Fret

[brianf]

Why am I getting fret buzz in the higher frets (above 14th)?

My action at the 12th is fairly high 5/64 bass side 4/64th treble side.

I have tried different relief amounts from 5 thou. to 14 thou. at the 7th fret. Same result. I put a straight edge along the neck when I had it set for no relief and there does not seem to be a high fret. Also new strings (Fender 150 bullets) 10>46.

I don't get it.
Please help.

Ahhhhhhhh!!!!!

brianf

[sk66]

sounds like neck angle. easiest way to set action is to adjust bridge so there's no buzz at the 12th fret, then set neck relief. If the bridge winds up way high, it need the angle andjusted.

[bayou bostick]

This sounds like one of two things....


1) Check your pickup heighth. Sometimes if the pickups are adjusted too high, they can make the strings sound "buzzy"

2)What kind of straghtedge did you use? Did you use a backlight? The reason I ask is that this sounds like a "rising tongue".

Many guitars develop a hump between the 14th and last fret. This point of the neck that has different stress on it because it bolted to the body here. (acoustics and set-necks can have similiar problems)

If this is the case, the frets may be able to be leveled. If there's not much fret height to work with, you may be looking at a a refret.

[brianf]

To SK66

How does the neck angle factor in? Its an adjustment I have never tried and not heard much about.


To bayou bostick

Pickups are quite low. Tons of room.

The straight edge is a 20" steel ruler. I dont know about backlighting but I assume you mean was it lit from behind. It was not lit from behind but while it was in the playing position I had my son hold the on edge ruler on the frets and I looked down against a white floor. Sort of the same effect.

I raised the string height about a quarter turn on each saddle and most of the buzz went away. But now the string height is so high. I don't have this problem on my PRS or LP.

Quite frustrating.

Thanks for the info guys.

brianf

[sk66]

Neck angle really determines the bridge height. neck relief is for playability. If you set the bridge so it doesn't buzz fretted at the 12-15, then set the relief for open/first position you'll wind up with a flatter neck and lower action. It does sound like a hump possibly but you said you checked it so I'm leaving that out...

[brianf]

Update.

I raised the string height and the buzz goes away but the string height is now 6/64ths. Way to high.


From here I tried taking some of the relief out to lower the string height (about 4 thou. at the 7th fret). The buzz now moved to the 3rd to 5th frets.
:gun1

How does the neck angle factor in or should I leave it alone.

BTW 2001 American DLX Fat Strat with Maple fingerboard.

New Fender 150 bullets 10>46.

Again thanks for any info.

brianf

[bayou bostick]

Well, the technique for reading the neck that you used was pretty accurate. Even in the playing position like Dan says!

I use a G.E. Brightstick as a "backlight" when reading the straightness of a neck. You can really see the light poking through the bottom of the staight-edge.

I see you've posted the question on the L.P.F. for Dan. Good move. He will nail it very quickly.

I'm just a Dan Erlewine wanna-be!!

[brianf]

To bayou bostick

This is so frustrating. I have not had this problem before. PRS and LP set up easy.

I just tried a different set of strings. Gibson Historic 10>46. Same result.

My son's MIM Strat is perfect!!!! This one on the other hand has given me fits for the past 18 months or so.

It will play great sometimes and then out of no where, yikes.

I've checked even little things like--- if the neck screws are tight or the bridge loose.

I might just have to send it to Dan.

brianf

[Teleologist]

Like some others have already said, adjusting the neck relief has little effect on fret buzz up past the 14th fret. The heel starts at 15 and the truss rod anchors ~18 but things are pretty stiff up there. Someone already mentioned ski-slope, but IMO a better way to check for that is with a 6" ruler from about the 15th fret up. The modern 22 fret neck sort of has that 22nd fret floating and it can cause problems. A major cause of ski-slope on Fenders is tightening the bejesus out of the neck bolts, especially if the neck has a shim(many vintage style necks do) or the micro-tilt is adjusted to add some pitch(most are from the factory). If the neck plate is bending in at the corners, the screws are way too tight. Tight enough to prevent shifting is tight enough. BTW - According to George Fullerton, sustain on Fenders comes from good contact between the back of the neck heel and the rear/vertical part of the neck pocket, not the bottom where the screws are.

Anway, if the bolts are OK and a 6" ruler shows a high fret, it can be dressed down and everything will be OK. In the meantime, try this. Set the neck relief to .008-.010" and adjust the strings at the bridge for the lowest height that doesn't buzz up past 14, then measure the string height at the 17th fret, not the 12th. Next reduce the relief until it starts buzzing at 3-5, readjusting the string height each time at 17 back to the height you measured before. When you do get buzz at 3-5, add about .002" of relief and readjust the height at 17. You'll be about as low as you can go with things the way they are.

FWIW adjusting the neck tilt or pitch only affects the height of the strings at the bridge, it doesn't change relief or have any effect on fret buzz. It's done when you run out of adjustment at the bridge or you want more downward string pressure on the saddles(some Amer Std Tele saddles will float if all the pitch is removed and this will cause poor tone and buzzing at the bridge itself).

[brianf]

To Teleologist

Many Thanks. I did the step by step the way you suggested, sort of working from both ends. It is a bit lower now. The buzzing past 12 is gone and there is a little between 5 to 9th positions. I can live with it.

Would going to 11's help?

Thanks Again
brianf

[Teleologist]

IMO 11's probably wouldn't help. You might get less buzz, but the added stiffness wouldn't make it play easier.

If the guitar is a 'keeper', think about having the frets leveled and dressed by someone who knows what they're doing after it's about a year old. I suspect maple necks move around more than mahagony as they settle in under string tension and age a bit, especially in areas with seasonal climate changes. If you have a dry season, that's a good time to do it since any fret sprout can be fixed as well. It'll play like a dream afterwards.