1965 Stratocaster neck project ! HELP

[fguki]

hey guys !

I have bought this 1965 Fender Strat neck project:

http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?...tem=3766593630

PLease tell me, which fretboard will I need to buy? Please give me the specs.
I will buy it from stewmac.com.

Regards

F.

[soapbarstrat]

I see one photo there that tells me it's not worth a new fret-board. It might be worth patching a scrap piece of fret-board in there. But from what I see the whole heel area from front to back has been broken. The truss-rod is probably shot .

It's a scrap neck. Sorry

[Tele-Bob]

Yup, it's junk.

Not to mention that the Fender logo on the headstock is wrong for that year. I think that neck is somewhat suspect to begin with.

The guy says it's a 20 fret neck. It should be 21 frets.

The other odd thing is that, in the photo showing the side of the neck, there is a dark band that goes around the side and heel, which does not appear in the close-up heel photo showing the date. There's something rotten in Denmark if you ask me. This one looks mighty suspect.

[Wilko]

Ditto,

Also CBS was Jan 65, so the Pre-CBS is wrong altogether.

Extra holes for nut locking, totally broken, etc.

[Cogs]

The guy says it's a 20 fret neck. It should be 21 frets.

I think it was a 21 fret neck that now only has 20 frets:bwa
You need a 25.5" rosewood fretboard & probably a new truss-rod. It would be more than I would care to take on, but if you can pull it off, more power to ya!

[moonpie]

That's a Bronco neck, isn't it?

[Kap'n]

Broncos are '67 and later, 24" and 22 frets.

[Wilko]

Ya know, I've been thinking about this one.

If you get a new piece of maple, and a new piece of rosewood. Then a new truss rod and nut. Cut some frets and you'll be golden!

[Cogs]

It would occupy vintage space!

[fguki]

Well, I dont give up that easy usually.
My skills in restoring are pretty good I would say without being cocky I hope.

Yeah I was thinking of adding a new piece of hard maple to it to make it stable again. I dont know yet if I will put on a new fretboard or leave the old one and try to add a new piece where that part is missing. Replacing the Trussrod and the Frets will be no problem.
The extra hole (s), I will fill with either real wood or woodfiller. That`s the best that comes on my mind right now.

So let`s not talk about the building and restoring aspects for a moment.

At least, I wanted a real Strat neck from 65. No matter how "scrappy" it is right now. It is a fun project for me. Nothing more nothing less. I don`t expect it to be a $1700 when it`s finished.

Tell me more about the Fender decal ! Does it not fit to that model of neck? Please tell me more.
Did the seller fake something? What is your opinion?

[Tele-Bob]

Far as I know, that's a 70's Fender logo on the headstock.

[Cogs]

That's not a very good picture, but the logo looks correct to me. It's what they call a "transitional" logo- larger "Fender", small font "STRATOCASTER". The patent numbers would tell us more, but even those are being counterfeited these days, too.

[Wilko]

That is one thrashed neck.
You could repair the maple like in the drawing. Then see if you can get a thin enough piece of rosewood to veneer over it. You could also plane the mple flat and put on a slab board. That would make the neck stronger and probably sound better because it will be more ridged.


The logo is called a transitional logo and was used from '65 till the logo changed to black with gold outline. Black logos showed up in July of 68.

[BLUELOU]

HI IF YOU LIKE THE OLD NECK AND ARE SKILLED AT WOODWORKING ETC CREATIVITY THE SKY IS THE LIMIT MORE POWER TO YOU
LOGO WISE THERES SPECULATIONS ON THEM ALL OVER THE WORLD I FOUND ONE ON THE WALL IN THE PYRAMIDS
PPL STICK LOGOS OF ALL YRS ON DIFF NECKS MAYBE IT WAS POSSIBLY REPLACED
IM NOT IMPLYING YOURS IS A REPLACEMENT DECAL OR WRONG YR DECAL
IF SOMETHING MAKES YOU HAPPY BRO GO FOR IT AND ENJOY IT LIFE IS YOURS THE SKY IS THE LIMIT
I HAD TO REPLACE A NECK ON ONE OF MY OLD STRATS BECAUSE A FIRE DESTROYED THE CLUB
I STILL LOVE THAT OL GUITAR NO MATTER WHAT AND MY POINT IS IF IT MAKES YOU HAPPY THEN GO FOR IT ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE NOTHING IS IMPOSSIBLE

THAT BREAK CAN EASILY BE REPAIRED WITH TLC

LIKE WHAT WILKO DREW UP IT IS GOOD IDEA WILKO
WOODWORKING IS FUN AND GUITAR REPAIRS ARE ENJOYABLE

GOOD LUCK

SINCERELY
BLUELOU
GODBLESS

[Tele-Bob]

Yeah wilko, great diagram. Very helpful.

[BLUELOU]

WHAT THE PICTURE DESCRIBES IS A SEVERE BREAK I THINK THE TIME /COST /PARTS FACTOR ARE A KEY INGREDIENT IN ONES DETERMINATION BUT SOMETIMES REPLACING A NECK IS EASIER AND FASTER THIS WAY IMOP PLEASE DO NOT TAKE THIS OFFENSIVELY I WOULD NEVER EVER OFFEND SOMEONE

IN MY INSTANCE FOR ME I LOOK AT PRACTICALLITY AND TIME IN MY CASE
AND I WOULD REPLACE THE NECK
BUT
IT ALL DEPENDS ON THE COLLECTOR PERSONALLY
ITS A PERSONAL CHOICE THATS ALL
WHAT EVER YOU CHOOSE I WISH YOU LUCK

MY GUITAR A 68 STRATOICASTER THAT GOT BURNT AND NECK FRIED BROKEN IN A CLUB FIRE I ENDED UP REPLACING THE NECK THANKS TO FENDER I CONTACTED FENDERSHIPPED THEM THE GUITAR AND HAD IT REPAIRED
I AM NOT A SKILLED WOODWORKER TO HAVE FIXED THIS SEVERITY
I COULDNT REPAIR MY FIRE DESTROYED BROKEN NECK I WISH I COULD HAVE BUT THE HEADSTOCK AND NECK WAS A BROKEN MESS IT GOT NICELY REPLACED ODDLY MINE WAS BROKEN IN MIDDLE AS ROOF COLLAPSED OR SOMETHING ON IT


BUT I SWAP NECKS ALOT ON FENDER GUITARS ITS ALL FUN I DONT COLLECT THEM FOR $$$
I USE MY BABIES

WHAT I DO IS FOR PRACTICALITY AND NECESSITY I THINK TIME = $$$
GOOD LUCK

[fguki]

hey guys, thanx for your answers so far.

Bluelou, I got cha ! Its a fun project for me, as I said. I will glue it myself. I guess I will get this done. If I don`t... so what. Shit happens. Then, I just hang it on my toilet wall :-)

I recieved the neck today and the decal must have been replaced (if so ?????) a LONG time ago. Or someone did a really good relic job on it :-)

So here are the pat numbers I can read:

2 , 5 7 3 , 2 5 4
2 , ? 6 0 , 9 0 0
2 , ? ? ? , ? ? ?
2, 1 4 3 , 0 ? ?
2, 8 1 ? , ? ? ?















So here`s how I will start restoring it:

- Removing the fretboard
- Gluing the two maple pieces together (incl 2 new maple pieces)
- Filling out gaps and holes with wood filler
- Replacing the trussrod
- Adding new fretboard
- Adding new nut
- Adding new fretwire
- Reassembling the old Dot inlays (even the real tiny ones on the side)
- Adding Kluson Tuners

What would you change or add/remove to/on my list ?



By the way. Which fretboard will I need? On the top it`s smaller than on the bottom. And which trussrod will I need?
Maybe someone can look up stewmac.com and help me finding the right parts!

Thank you guys and I wish you a merry christmas from germany

[Wilko]

That logo is right for that guitar.The transitional logo was used on small and large headstock guitars. the spaghetti logo was phased out in 65.

Why do you think it was replaced?

A HUGE portion of the "mojo" comes from the old decals left intact. If you are carefull, you can repair that neck and have it actually look cool and old (like it is)

[Wilko]

I've been thinking more abou that decal. Since you have the pat numbers there, you know it's gotta be right. Later decals don't have all those numbers.
That is a very specific neck and decal only available for a part of '65. If you are going to do so much work on that neck, it's really best to leave the decal as proof of the neck's authenticity and preserve the mojo.


About the trussrod. The basic style is what should go in there with some minor tweaking maybe necc. The long cross ended nut is at stew mac too.

Before you peal the old board off, take accurate measurements of the nut and fret locations.

For a fingerboard, get a thin veneer of rosewood and glue it on, then trim to the neck. You should be able to plane/blocksand the sides without doing too much damage to the maple sides of the neck. Install the markers and plane it straight. If you start with the thickest board that you can form to the neck radius, you can build a very thick stable neck. Once the board is planed flat (the markers will now be flush) you can slot it for frets and a nut.

[Cogs]

Stewmac sells a pre-slotted fretboard, I think.

[fguki]

@71818


Yeah, they do ! I already wrote them, and they answered:


Thank you for contacting us.
Out of curiosity, what is broken??
You might consider repairing the neck as is to retain the value of the old wood.
There is likely no fingerboard to replace. A 1956 Stratocaster would have had a one piece maple neck with the truss rod loaded in through the back. A darker filler strip or skunk stripe conceals the truss rod and is visible when you look at the back side of the neck.
Our #0155 fretwire is close to the original. We stock a variety of nut materials to choose from, we suggest the #0024 vintage bone. Our traditional truss rod kit can be modified for use in a Fender. You will likely need to install a different barrel nut and the #0973 truss rod nut.
You will need to remove the skunk stripe on the back of the neck to install the new rod. This can be carefully routed or chiseled out.
If you do not have experience with this type of repair, we recommend taking the instrument to a reputable repair person in your area to ensure proper restoration.
Let me know if I can provide further assistance.

Best Regards,

E.C


I will send them some pix of the neck, so they can "make themselves a picture" as we say over here.
The thing that stikes me is, that the fingerboard glued to the neck is not plane on its bottom. Its curved and I wonder how I should get that done? I wonder if there is a tool to make it round. I hope you know what I am talking about.




@Wilko

That is a very specific neck and decal only available for a part of '65

Which part? Do you know the exact months? Must have been the late ones. Around Fall or Winter.

Why do you think it was replaced?

Because someone earlier in this thread wrote it ! :-)

[fguki]

I added some links to pics of the "junk" neck :-) scoll up a little!

[Wilko]

That letter from Fender is regarding a 1956 neck and not a 1965. Very different.

The repair can be done as I have illustrated. The fingerboard is another matter. The '62 and later necks have the veneer (thin rosewood steamed and bent to fit the rounded shape of the fingerboard) and Stew Mac and others only sell a slab board for flat installation. A qualified wood store should be able to mill down a plain board to the thin size needed to bend around the neck radius to replace your board. Or, as I wrote earlier, you could convert it to a slab board. that would not be accurate to the 65 date though.

January 1965 CBS bought Fender and shortly after that, Fender changed to the heavier script logo like your neck has. Later that year the headstock was enlarged. So, in 1965 there are three neck types. One has a small headstock and spaghetti logo, one has a small headstock and the transition logo (yours, with 5 Pat numbers) and the other is a large headstock with a transistion logo.
Before 1965 the decal didn't have as many numbers. The most common has spaghetti logo with only "WITH SYNCHRONIZED TREMOLO" and no numbers (1954-1961)

[fguki]

Oh ! Now I see ! I have a twist of digits in it !
E. of Stewmac thought it was a 56 neck ! Maybe I wrote it wrong. Missunderstanding !
I will wait until he wrote again....

Well, that thing with the fratboard sucks pretty much. I dont know yet how I can get the bending process done :-(
Maybe I will convert it to a slab board neck. Dunno yet.
I will sleep over it now. Maybe anyone else has got any idea.

[Cogs]

It may not be possible, but I'd try to salvage that fingerboard. It looks like it has beautiful grain to it. Even if there were small parts missing, you could patch it w/some epoxy & it would definitely be a conversation piece. I would still remove it first.

[Wilko]

You may be able to save the finger board, but I'm pretty sure it will not separate from the neck with breaking at every fret slot.

I don't think it would be too hard to put a 3/32" veneer of rosewood onto it. You can heat it with a household steam iron and clamp it tight using a bunch of clamps and some neoprene or rubber to help distribute the pressure. Because of how thin it needs to be, you probably couldn't use a pre slotted board.

Now I'm wishing I had that project to do. Seems like it might be kinda fun!

[Cogs]

Dang, you're right about breaking at the fret slots; I forgot it was a cap & not a slab. Still, I'd try to save it somehow.
You could always make concave & convex sanding blocks for the neck & fingerboard. That's what I would try.

[Wilko]

I just looked at the pics some more... I see that some fretboard is actually missing so restore is out of the question.

About the difference between the 56 and 65, It's actually the same thing. Both have rear-loaded truss rods with skunk stripes. The only difference is the rosewood added after the fact.

[Cogs]

No skunk stripe on that baby. I think you are mistaken on that point, Wilko.

[Wilko]

Right..what was I thinking!?

[soapbarstrat]

Does it look like someone had glued the broken pieces before ? The one shot almost makes me think so. Reminds me of a 4,000 year old piece of pottery I once restored, that had been broken and glued before. Real fun removing endless traces of glue.
I'd at least try heating and trying to lift the rosewood off. Leave the frets in, they're in that board tight. They were pushed in from the side (if original). The reason I would want to do that, is to rout some channels that the fret-board will later cover. I'd probably want some graphite bars in the channels, or wood, like in Wilko's drawing , especially across the break. Just thinking out-loud here.
For patching the missing rosewood, I'd see what kind of old rosewood scraps some other local luthiers might have.
And, if you have this much nerve to go through such a repair, why not at least *try* to salvage the T-rod ? Might just take some bending in a vise.
I once rebuilt an early 80's fender neck that had been smashed into at least 25 pieces. So much wood was too damaged to put back on the neck, that I had to use fiberglass in many places, especially the headstock. I then put on a black phenolic fret-board. Since I still considered it a scrap neck, I scalloped the fret-board to find out what that's all about. I then sprayed the back of the neck and headstock with a can of flat black sportscar "hood" paint. Some months later, I demo-ed an amp at the big popular guitar shop in town, run by "guitar experts" , who were always selling guitars to famous players. While I'm playing, one of them walks up and says, " I see you're using a graphite neck, how do you like it ? ". I then told him the whole story about the neck, and he wasn't too happy about that.
Now that I know what you guys in Germany are willing to pay for badly broken necks, I'll start gathering up some stuff to bring , next time I'm going there.

*** Don't forget, if you refret it, that you need to file down the fret-tangs of the new frets so they'll go into those shallow fret-slots

[Tele-Bob]

This is how I would approach the curved fretboard. Bear in mind, there are several small details to work out such as "locating pins" and angled clamping surfaces on a wooden cradle, but here's the gist of the process anyway. Hope this helps.


I would get a thin piece of rosewood and make a small steam chamber just big enough for the fretboard. The curved fretboard will help alot in making the neck stronger than a slab board will.

Anyway, get a piece of rosewood cut to thickness, and then steam it for like a whole day or two. The wetness of the fretboard actually helps the gluing process.

Once the neck surface has been prepared, you'll be able to glue the fretbaord right on to it.

I would suggest doing so by using three long pieces of steel bar stock, several C-clamps and a wooden neck cradle that you'll have to make.

Make a wooden cradle for the back of the neck. This is where the bottom of the C-clamps will grip.

Apply the glue to the new fretboard and set it into place.

Set the neck and fretboard into the cradle you made.

Lay a piece of steel bar stock down the center of the fretboard and clamp it down using three equally spaced clamps.

Then lay a piece of steel bar stock along one edge of the fretboard and just lightly bring up the clamp tension.

Do the same to the other edge of the fretboard and then begin tightening the clamps slowly and evenly to bend the fretboard around to match the radius. The more clamps you can use, the better. It spreads the clamping force more evenly.

Leave it for at least 24 hours.

Once it the glue has set up, you'll have to go about the business of cutting the fret slots.

Good luck. It's far more work than I would do for that neck but hey, at least it will have the right stamp on the heel when you're done. Enjoy.

[soapbarstrat]

I take back my comment about using graphite. I would not spend money on graphite for that neck.

[Strummin' Ronin]

Hey fguki - hi there.

How's the neck coming along? :)


If I had the time and the facilities to take on a project I know I would be tempted to take on something like that too - despite having a very limited knowledge in the behaviour of wood, woodworking and guitar playing... Being able to "repair" something so that it is "good as new" has something so cool about it!

What kind of Strat body will you put it with, when it is repaired? I keep seeing a metallic turquoise blue strat body with that neck!

[soapbarstrat]

I'm seeing an old "project" strat body that was hit by a metallic turquoise blue bolt of lightning

[Strummin' Ronin]

I'm seeing an old "project" strat body that was hit by a metallic turquoise blue bolt of lightning

Awww... that is mean!! It is still funny tho.

But come on, just because it is not economical in terms of time required to do the repairs, it could still be repaired, right?

[fguki]

sold !

I bought it for $150 ... I sold it as it is for $450

:-D

[Cogs]

You think now that you've made a decent profit...
Three years from now you will kick yourself, thinking you should have hung onto it & sold it a 3x that amount!
;)