How do I get maximum sustain/distortion (not too dirty) from my champion 100 amp

Hi, and thanks in advance to all. I am using a fender strat ultra with blue gold dually red pickups, and a boss me-80 effects unit. I have found that adding some delay through the amp setting greatly increases sustain. I like the black face setting best. Any suggestions as to amp and/or pedal settings to obtain what I am looking for? I've read that the more I achieve this through the amp, the better, but I can't blast my ears out to get what I want.

I've found that sustain begins with the guitar. Is your strat ultra resonant? Do chords make the neck and body vibrate? A dead or dull guitar will be very hard to make sustain short of sample and hold technology.

What kind of sustain are you looking for? Parisian Walkways by Gary Moore type of sustain? Carlos Santana sustain? David Gilmour? I'm not familiar with the Champion 100 amp but I looked it up and it seems like a decent enough of a base to build your sound. I think midrange tones are the ones with the most legs as far as sustained guitar goes so you probably don't want to scoop your sound if you want to make it sing out loud and long. Watch the bass so it doesn't muddy up the sound.

I have almost no experience with delays so I'm no help there, hopefully some of our pedal effects-loving bros can chime in (heh heh, pun not intended but it works).

1. more volume ergo more compression
2. walk around until you find a spot where your guitar is feedbacking with the amp particularly niceley
3. https://i.ytimg.com/vi/pBOR3isdIOg/hqdefault.jpg

Thanks everyone. My guitar is resonant so that's not the issue. I'd like Gilmour and Clapton (as in the song "Groaning the Blues": makes my hair stand on end) sustain.

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Originally Posted by CharlieX

Thanks everyone. My guitar is resonant so that's not the issue. I'd like Gilmour and Clapton (as in the song "Groaning the Blues": makes my hair stand on end) sustain.

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Clapton plays a High Powered Twin and Gilmour DR103, both at crushing volumes.

Never found a pedal or small amp (<2xel84) that can do that. Frankly even if you acquired a Twin and attenuated it, it would not do it as much.

A compressor can help.

Crushing Volume is OUT, LOL. I already have moderate hearing loss, but thanks anyway.

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Originally Posted by CharlieX

Crushing Volume is OUT, LOL. I already have moderate hearing loss, but thanks anyway.

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talk to your doctor about getting proper earplugs. they are fitted to your ears and attenuate frequencies evenly so you dont get the massive high end loss.

that's what I practice with.

and crushing is overstating it. I dont consider practicing at 100db @ 1m crushing because I tend not to put my head up against the amp, stand on axis, etc.

Thanks, I already have professional musicians earplugs, but usually when I play with my bands, it's just in the basement for fun, and that kind of volume is a non-starter.

CharlieX,

I use both tube amps and a modeler live depending on the venue. Modelers can give you almost unlimited sustain and they can do so at small venue volumes - in fact - that's where they shine.

Here's a few things to try:

Start with a great clean amp model. Don't start with one of the presets which are almost universally "over the top" WRG to effects. Take some time and dial in a amp-only sound with no effects. Set the gain to where it's just beginning to get dirty. You don't want it to even be overdrive, just a little color.

Forget reverb and use delay instead. Tails are your friend. You'll want to get the repeats close enough that they run together but are still distinct. When in doubt, slow them down. They'll sound like echoes by yourself but they'll fill in when they get with the band.

By now you should have a sound that reminds you of The Edge on the Joshua Tree album.

Now, pull back the highs, push up the mids and bottom. Add your favorite overdrive. Start low on the gain and push it up until the sound breaks up. No more. This is your "dirty" sound.

Finally, add in distortion. Again, less is more. Remember that more distortion and OD you use, the more your guitar will get lost in the mix. You may have it on infinite sustain but if the distortion is too high you'll never hear it, it just becomes "white noise" in the mix. You'll have to push up the volume to hear yourself and you're into the vicious circle leading to sounding not-so-good.

The secret to good sustain is having a tone that cuts through the mix.

Now that you have the former things done, you can also try adding *SUBTLE* compression. You want low threshold and meduim slope. But remember - compressors by their very nature remove dynamics in you playing. Ghost notes become boomers, accents get washed out. In other words, they're great for those times you want to punch the audience in the face but a little goes a very, very long way. One of the most common sins I see other bands do is the guitar player using too much compressor. It just de-emotionalizes the music and takes the feel out. Use it with utmost caution. It's a great tool if you use it wisely but what sounds good to you might not be what's best for the band, and that's what matters most. Compressor leads shine the best when the rest of the band is playing softly.


Finally, if your modeler allows you select cabinet styles, consider a closed-back. Closed-backs are richer on the bottom end and that's where modelers sometimes need some help. It really helps if you can line out to the board and mix in through the mains too. A little mix in to FOH can make the modeler sound absolutely huge at lower volumes.

Long story short, sustain is counterintuitive. You can usually can get better sustain by taking things away rather than adding them. It's about being able to hear the guitar ringing out, not just the hit on the string. Too much effects buries the ring. When it doubt, take some out.

All IMHO and YMMV,

Chuck

CharlieX,

I use both tube amps and a modeler live depending on the venue. Modelers can give you almost unlimited sustain and they can do so at small venue volumes - in fact - that's where they shine.

Here's a few things to try:

Start with a great clean amp model. Don't start with one of the presets which are almost universally "over the top" WRG to effects. Take some time and dial in a amp-only sound with no effects. Set the gain to where it's just beginning to get dirty. You don't want it to even be overdrive, just a little color.

Forget reverb and use delay instead. Tails are your friend. You'll want to get the repeats close enough that they run together but are still distinct. When in doubt, slow them down. They'll sound like echoes by yourself but they'll fill in when they get with the band.

By now you should have a sound that reminds you of The Edge on the Joshua Tree album.

Now, pull back the highs, push up the mids and bottom. Add your favorite overdrive. Start low on the gain and push it up until the sound breaks up. No more. This is your "dirty" sound.

Finally, add in distortion. Again, less is more. Remember that more distortion and OD you use, the more your guitar will get lost in the mix. You may have it on infinite sustain but if the distortion is too high you'll never hear it, it just becomes "white noise" in the mix. You'll have to push up the volume to hear yourself and you're into the vicious circle leading to sounding not-so-good.

The secret to good sustain is having a tone that cuts through the mix.

Now that you have the former things done, you can also try adding *SUBTLE* compression. You want low threshold and meduim slope. But remember - compressors by their very nature remove dynamics in you playing. Ghost notes become boomers, accents get washed out. In other words, they're great for those times you want to punch the audience in the face but a little goes a very, very long way. One of the most common sins I see other bands do is the guitar player using too much compressor. It just de-emotionalizes the music and takes the feel out. Use it with utmost caution. It's a great tool if you use it wisely but what sounds good to you might not be what's best for the band, and that's what matters most. Compressor leads shine the best when the rest of the band is playing softly.


Finally, if your modeler allows you select cabinet styles, consider a closed-back. Closed-backs are richer on the bottom end and that's where modelers sometimes need some help. It really helps if you can line out to the board and mix in through the mains too. A little mix in to FOH can make the modeler sound absolutely huge at lower volumes.

Long story short, sustain is counterintuitive. You can usually can get better sustain by taking things away rather than adding them. It's about being able to hear the guitar ringing out, not just the hit on the string. Too much effects buries the ring. When it doubt, take some out.

Since you're using a MFX unit into a small amp, tweak the above to fit your rig.

All IMHO and YMMV,

Chuck

Hey Chuck, I know you addressed this to CharlieX, but this is great advice -- I have two modeling amps, and I find the clean settings the best to work with. I'm still new to amps and pedals, so this helps a lot in figuring out where to start and where to go. Thanks!

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Originally Posted by Offshore Angler

CharlieX,

I use both tube amps and a modeler live depending on the venue. Modelers can give you almost unlimited sustain and they can do so at small venue volumes - in fact - that's where they shine.

Here's a few things to try:

Start with a great clean amp model. Don't start with one of the presets which are almost universally "over the top" WRG to effects. Take some time and dial in a amp-only sound with no effects. Set the gain to where it's just beginning to get dirty. You don't want it to even be overdrive, just a little color.

Forget reverb and use delay instead. Tails are your friend. You'll want to get the repeats close enough that they run together but are still distinct. When in doubt, slow them down. They'll sound like echoes by yourself but they'll fill in when they get with the band.

By now you should have a sound that reminds you of The Edge on the Joshua Tree album.

Now, pull back the highs, push up the mids and bottom. Add your favorite overdrive. Start low on the gain and push it up until the sound breaks up. No more. This is your "dirty" sound.

Finally, add in distortion. Again, less is more. Remember that more distortion and OD you use, the more your guitar will get lost in the mix. You may have it on infinite sustain but if the distortion is too high you'll never hear it, it just becomes "white noise" in the mix. You'll have to push up the volume to hear yourself and you're into the vicious circle leading to sounding not-so-good.

The secret to good sustain is having a tone that cuts through the mix.

Now that you have the former things done, you can also try adding *SUBTLE* compression. You want low threshold and meduim slope. But remember - compressors by their very nature remove dynamics in you playing. Ghost notes become boomers, accents get washed out. In other words, they're great for those times you want to punch the audience in the face but a little goes a very, very long way. One of the most common sins I see other bands do is the guitar player using too much compressor. It just de-emotionalizes the music and takes the feel out. Use it with utmost caution. It's a great tool if you use it wisely but what sounds good to you might not be what's best for the band, and that's what matters most. Compressor leads shine the best when the rest of the band is playing softly.


Finally, if your modeler allows you select cabinet styles, consider a closed-back. Closed-backs are richer on the bottom end and that's where modelers sometimes need some help. It really helps if you can line out to the board and mix in through the mains too. A little mix in to FOH can make the modeler sound absolutely huge at lower volumes.

Long story short, sustain is counterintuitive. You can usually can get better sustain by taking things away rather than adding them. It's about being able to hear the guitar ringing out, not just the hit on the string. Too much effects buries the ring. When it doubt, take some out.

Since you're using a MFX unit into a small amp, tweak the above to fit your rig.

All IMHO and YMMV,

Chuck

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should make this a sticky. hopefully I can come back and find this when it comes time to employ a modeler/FX unit

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Offshore Angler

CharlieX,

I use both tube amps and a modeler live depending on the venue. Modelers can give you almost unlimited sustain and they can do so at small venue volumes - in fact - that's where they shine.

Here's a few things to try:

Start with a great clean amp model. Don't start with one of the presets which are almost universally "over the top" WRG to effects. Take some time and dial in a amp-only sound with no effects. Set the gain to where it's just beginning to get dirty. You don't want it to even be overdrive, just a little color.

Forget reverb and use delay instead. Tails are your friend. You'll want to get the repeats close enough that they run together but are still distinct. When in doubt, slow them down. They'll sound like echoes by yourself but they'll fill in when they get with the band.

By now you should have a sound that reminds you of The Edge on the Joshua Tree album.

Now, pull back the highs, push up the mids and bottom. Add your favorite overdrive. Start low on the gain and push it up until the sound breaks up. No more. This is your "dirty" sound.

Finally, add in distortion. Again, less is more. Remember that more distortion and OD you use, the more your guitar will get lost in the mix. You may have it on infinite sustain but if the distortion is too high you'll never hear it, it just becomes "white noise" in the mix. You'll have to push up the volume to hear yourself and you're into the vicious circle leading to sounding not-so-good.

The secret to good sustain is having a tone that cuts through the mix.

Now that you have the former things done, you can also try adding *SUBTLE* compression. You want low threshold and meduim slope. But remember - compressors by their very nature remove dynamics in you playing. Ghost notes become boomers, accents get washed out. In other words, they're great for those times you want to punch the audience in the face but a little goes a very, very long way. One of the most common sins I see other bands do is the guitar player using too much compressor. It just de-emotionalizes the music and takes the feel out. Use it with utmost caution. It's a great tool if you use it wisely but what sounds good to you might not be what's best for the band, and that's what matters most. Compressor leads shine the best when the rest of the band is playing softly.


Finally, if your modeler allows you select cabinet styles, consider a closed-back. Closed-backs are richer on the bottom end and that's where modelers sometimes need some help. It really helps if you can line out to the board and mix in through the mains too. A little mix in to FOH can make the modeler sound absolutely huge at lower volumes.

Long story short, sustain is counterintuitive. You can usually can get better sustain by taking things away rather than adding them. It's about being able to hear the guitar ringing out, not just the hit on the string. Too much effects buries the ring. When it doubt, take some out.

All IMHO and YMMV,

Chuck

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: Thanks, Chuck, for all the effort you put into helping me, and the great advice.

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Originally Posted by DanTheBluesMan

should make this a sticky. hopefully I can come back and find this when it comes time to employ a modeler/FX unit

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I think if you subscribe to it (Thread tools, upper right menu), you'll be able to come back to it any time.

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Originally Posted by OldStrummer

I think if you subscribe to it (Thread tools, upper right menu), you'll be able to come back to it any time.

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ooo, right. Good idea, I completely forgot about that. Thanks:dude