Veneer--What Do You Think about It?
Recently, I believe our Fred posted a pic of a beautiful Telecaster. I think it was a veneer, but I don't know for sure. There is absolutely nothing wrong with it if you don't mind that.
I haven't liked veneer because I bought an MIM Strat years ago that had veneer. I would rather have seen flawed wood than to have what seemed to me like a fake finish. I had an Epi les paul I loved until I realized that the sunburst top was just veneer. It sounded no where near as good as my Gibson. I didn't mind getting rid of it.
Maybe my point of view is silly about veneer like that.
Please don't feel that I'm criticizing your guitars if they have veneer. I realize that my prejudice may be based on 60s era assumptions that perhaps went wrong.
What do you think?
Re: Veneer--What Do You Think about It?
I judge this on a guitar to guitar basis. My 1980 Hamer Sunburst has a maple veneer top, and of course the bodies on my ES335 and ES225 are both made entirely out of veneer. These are all good guitars.
I didn't appreciate not knowing that my '93 and '96 Am. Std. Strats and '95 Am. Std. Tele had butcher block bodies with veneer tops and backs, but the '96 Strat and the Tele did sound good and play well (the '93 Strat was kind of a dog).
My Les Paul, Guild Blues 90 and Carvin DC150 all have thick, nicely figured maple tops.
Re: Veneer--What Do You Think about It?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Don
I judge this on a guitar to guitar basis. My 1980 Hamer Sunburst has a maple veneer top, and of course the bodies on my ES335 and ES225 are both made entirely out of veneer. These are all good guitars.
I didn't appreciate not knowing that my '93 and '96 Am. Std. Strats and '95 Am. Std. Tele had butcher block bodies with veneer tops and backs, but the '96 Strat and the Tele did sound good and play well (the '93 Strat was kind of a dog).
My Les Paul, Guild Blues 90 and Carvin DC150 all have thick, nicely figured maple tops.
Don, I am 99% sure no American Standard Strat ever had veneer on them. At least not from the factory. I recently came across a thread in another forum and this fellow had discussed this extensively with the company.
I guess this is good news to you if you still have those guitars and like them.
Re: Veneer--What Do You Think about It?
P.S. not that I mind veneer.
I owned an Epi Les Paul Standard that had a maple veneer, and I had many other reasons not to like it, the veneer never bothered me.
Re: Veneer--What Do You Think about It?
I had a tele with a photo lam top, which I guess counts as a veneer. I didn't like it very much (it was my first tele and didn't endear me to them) as it had heavy weight, uncomfortably thin and wide neck, sharp hard edges to the fingerboard, the binding on the body dug into my ribs and it just didn't sound very good. No snap, no twang. I don't remember what the pickups were.
It was a long time before I came around to the tele camp again because of that guitar. Darn shame.
Re: Veneer--What Do You Think about It?
Veneer isn't fake. Veneer would be an actual slice of quilted maple attached to the top of the guitar. Quilted maple top for instance. Many American Stratocasters come like that.
https://images.reverb.com/image/uplo...h693b8qeqf.jpg
https://www.fmicassets.com/Damroot/Z...ght_001_nr.jpg
Re: Veneer--What Do You Think about It?
This would be an expensive Strat with a quilted maple top because if you look the veneer is book matched almost perfectly.
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/20...G?v=1565094442
Re: Veneer--What Do You Think about It?
An unfortunate true tale about the American Standards and veneer...
https://www.strat-talk.com/threads/a....126831/page-5
Even Dan Smith and George Blanda were clear: veneers were shortly used in American guitars in the 80s, right at the transition period between the staple US Strat and what would become the American Standard series but the myth remained and still lends a bad rep to some guitars.
Re: Veneer--What Do You Think about It?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Sérgio
Don, I am 99% sure no American Standard Strat ever had veneer on them. At least not from the factory. I recently came across a thread in another forum and this fellow had discussed this extensively with the company.
I guess this is good news to you if you still have those guitars and like them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Sérgio
An unfortunate true tale about the American Standards and veneer...
https://www.strat-talk.com/threads/a....126831/page-5
Even Dan Smith and George Blanda were clear: veneers were shortly used in American guitars in the 80s, right at the transition period between the staple US Strat and what would become the American Standard series but the myth remained and still lends a bad rep to some guitars.
I owned three of them. All brand new. All sunburst. All veneered regardless of any internet discussion (I wasn't even aware of internet forums at the time). You could tell if you looked under the pickguard or control plate.
Also, regardless of what has been said, the black painted belly cut on sunburst Strats was clearly to hide veneer- same as on MIM Stds, though they may have done that on all of them whether they were veneered or not.
I don't have any of the guitars now. I didn't sell them because of the veneer. I sold them when I bought a refinished, re-necked '57 Strat and built my '50s style Broadcaster/Telecaster clone.
I'd like to repeat that the '96 Strat and '95 Tele were very good guitars and the veneer did not detract from that.
Re: Veneer--What Do You Think about It?
Are you talking about veneer or multi-piece bodies?
Re: Veneer--What Do You Think about It?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Don
I owned three of them. All brand new. All sunburst. All veneered regardless of any internet discussion (I wasn't even aware of internet forums at the time). You could tell if you looked under the pickguard or control plate.
Also, regardless of what has been said, the black painted belly cut on sunburst Strats was clearly to hide veneer- same as on MIM Stds, though they may have done that on all of them whether they were veneered or not.
I don't have any of the guitars now. I didn't sell them because of the veneer. I sold them when I bought a refinished, re-necked '57 Strat and built my '50s style Broadcaster/Telecaster clone.
I'd like to repeat that the '96 Strat and '95 Tele were very good guitars and the veneer did not detract from that.
If you are positively sure, then you are... Which is interesting since both the company and the developers of that series (Blanda and Smith) say it didn't feature veneers, which isn't exactly "internet discussion". That makes me think of old stock bodies being used but '96 is a late year for that. Curious.
Re: Veneer--What Do You Think about It?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mikesr1963
Are you talking about veneer or multi-piece bodies?
I think he means veneer indeed. A thin layer of figured wood glued onto the top and backside of the guitar to hide the seams between wood pieces.
I myself have never seen an American Standard strat with veneer and so far thought they had ditched that in the late 80s.
Re: Veneer--What Do You Think about It?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mikesr1963
Are you talking about veneer or multi-piece bodies?
Veneer. A thin layer on the front and back of the body. The bodies used several pieces as well (as seen in the Strats' pickup/electronics cavities).
Re: Veneer--What Do You Think about It?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Don
Veneer. A thin layer on the front and back of the body. The bodies used several pieces as well (as seen in the Strats' pickup/electronics cavities).
Oh I know what veneer is but it's not an issue. I can see it being a personal preference on appearance, but it doesn't cheapen the guitar or deaden the sound. A majority of veneer top guitars come with painted back with no veneer at all. No one is trying to hide anything you just don't put veneer on the back of guitars where belt rash is going to happen. Even when you pony up $10,000 for a new Gibson LP 59 limited they don't have the veneer on the back. It's option, not a requirement.
Re: Veneer--What Do You Think about It?
Let me say again that I know it's a matter of choice. I know it's not a problem as far as sound or playability. I don't mean to belittle anyone's choice. I just didn't like it on my MIM because I really like to see the body wood whether it's got five joins and a knothole or is perfect.
And the guitar I want the most is the laminate topped 335. I'd have no problem there. Somehow that seems different to me from putting veneer on a solid body.
I really ought not feel badly about it in any way--I like it when people cover their guitars in drawings or designs, so not much different from a veneer.
Re: Veneer--What Do You Think about It?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mikesr1963
Oh I know what veneer is but it's not an issue. I can see it being a personal preference on appearance, but it doesn't cheapen the guitar or deaden the sound. A majority of veneer top guitars come with painted back with no veneer at all. No one is trying to hide anything you just don't put veneer on the back of guitars where belt rash is going to happen. Even when you pony up $10,000 for a new Gibson LP 59 limited they don't have the veneer on the back. It's option, not a requirement.
I was making it clear that I knew what veneer was, not questioning whether you knew what veneer was. Fender was either using veneer to provide a smoother surface to put finish on or to hide the fact that they were making bodies out of several pieces. I doubt it had any affect on tone at all. My only concern is that it was done without customers realizing. Whether or not that matters is up to the individual customer. That was not why I sold my guitars.
Re: Veneer--What Do You Think about It?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Don
I was making it clear that I knew what veneer was, not questioning whether you knew what veneer was. Fender was either using veneer to provide a smoother surface to put finish on or to hide the fact that they were making bodies out of several pieces. I doubt it had any affect on tone at all. My only concern is that it was done without customers realizing. Whether or not that matters is up to the individual customer. That was not why I sold my guitars.
No, they don't hide the fact they make bodies out of more than one piece of wood. It's fairly common knowledge that Stratocasters are made from 2 to 7 pieces of wood depending on the model, well, that is, if you're on the end of refinishing and modifying strat bodies. For the last 20 years anyway; that's as far as I go back with it. Since I've never refinished expensive strats it's my opinion that as the price goes up the number of pieces comes down. I haven't investigated to know if anyone still makes bodies from a single piece of wood.
Re: Veneer--What Do You Think about It?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mikesr1963
No, they don't hide the fact they make bodies out of more than one piece of wood. It's fairly common knowledge that Stratocasters are made from 2 to 7 pieces of wood depending on the model, well, that is, if you're on the end of refinishing and modifying strat bodies. For the last 20 years anyway; that's as far as I go back with it. Since I've never refinished expensive strats it's my opinion that as the price goes up the number of pieces comes down. I haven't investigated to know if anyone still makes bodies from a single piece of wood.
I don’t think Fender ever sold the “one piece body” as a proper premium feature until their Custom Shop became a boutique, strats being very often multipiece since the early years.
Re: Veneer--What Do You Think about It?
I would rather not have a Veneer. Now if you are talking a 1/4" or 3/8" top added that is acceptable.
Re: Veneer--What Do You Think about It?
what he said. I think my foto flame was literally a picture of a flame top glued to the top of the body on that tele long ago. Unless I'm mistaken I think that's what they meant by a 'foto flame'
Re: Veneer--What Do You Think about It?
I know it doesn't make a diff to the sound, but I just don't dig thin veneer on a solid body top. Semi-hollows can have pressed veneer and that doesn't bother me. I was disappointed to find out my Epi LP had a veneer top instead of a maple cap; it was probably fotoflame. . It cheapened the guitar for me. And then the MIM sunburst Strat--didn't like the ceramic pups, and the veneer looked cheap and unreal. It wasn't the greatest sounding guitar, and I was so happy to get it out of my house.
