What are your thoughts on the Fender custom shop guitars? Quality, playability. They seem very pricey..
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What are your thoughts on the Fender custom shop guitars? Quality, playability. They seem very pricey..
My Fender Custom Shop Robin Trower Artist Signature Stratocaster is probably the best electric guitar I own (I have four Fender Strats and one G&L S-type). Part of the allure is the bling (abalone or mother-of-pearl fret markers), color (Midnight Wine Burst) but the other part is the sheer playability. The neck is super smooth, the pickups sound great, and the build quality is top notch.
I note that Robin Trower plays these signature models stock. Well, they were designed by/for him, so it makes sense. Knowing that Trower uses a very heavy gauge string (12s) and tunes down a full step also suggests the guitar withstands the string tension capably.
Pricey? Yes, compared to some other guitars. But not as much as some other guitars. You get what you pay for, I think. Most of the time. :hi:
https://photos.smugmug.com/Guitar-Lo...10.45.27-L.jpg
I very much enjoyed my Custom Shop guitars when I had them. Were they worth the money? Well, they held value pretty well but that's easy because prices are always going up. For the most part, they are built a level or three up over lesser priced guitars. Generally speaking, they tend to be lighter. They often present neck profiles unlike CNC mass produced guitars.
Each instrument should be judged individually and taken on it’s merits, but as a general rule, CS guitars are lighter in weight which makes them feel more resonant to play. The time machine series are very close in looks and vibe to original vintage instruments and that makes them more coveted and desirable to own. These are sweeping generalisations and should not be a substitute for objective judgment. In my opinion, the CS offerings are not automatically better than their production counterparts and most certainly, without a shadow of a doubt, the fact that a guitar is built in the custom shop does not mean that it will sound better.
Of late, the prices instruments from the CS have escalated way out of proportion to their worth as musical instruments when compared to mainstream production guitars. The fact that it is finished in nitrocellulose lacquer and has been fashioned to have an aesthetically pleasing patina does not affect how it plays or how it sounds. The fact that it is acoustically vibrant does not translate to a good electrified tone.
Although there is a lot of BS and snake-oil about these things and the fact that very few of the “desirable” attributes of (semi) hand-made guitars actually contribute to better or more authentic tone, does not matter a jot compared to how the guitar makes you feel; if owning and playing a custom shop instrument makes you feel good, then that feeling will be translated through your fingers. In short, you will want to pick it up and play it more. That, I think is the justification for buying and owning one of these guitars.
Do not believe the hype. Custom Shop instruments are largely a marketing paradigm and in my opinion are held in high regard undeservedly. Buy a guitar because you love it and because it speaks to you… not because it’s expensive.
Happy to discuss… 😉
I own a 1960 "Time Machine" relic from 2013. It looks, plays, and sounds beautiful -- very authentic with its set of "AY" pickups, vintage fret wire, and 7¼" fretboard radius. The simulated wear and tear is both restrained and realistic. Was it worth $2800? Honestly, I can't say. Truth told, I could've built such a guitar for about half the price but I had no American-built Strats in my collection and I wanted the bragging rights.
And now you have perspectives from both sides of the aisle: @Phantomman, who is a legend in the DIY field, and OldStrummer, whose customizing work extends to changing the strings.
I think both of us, and I think @ajwain might agree, think that the bottom line comes down to how much do you like the guitar? I am at the point in my life where I can buy just about any guitar I like, but in younger, leaner times, I was perfectly happy with a secondhand or knock-off guitar. As long as I could play it...
A recent example: I've been playing a lot of acoustic guitar recently, and have added a few to my collection, for a variety of reasons. One I added, a Gretsch G9500 "Jim Dandy" is a parlor-sized guitar that I wanted to use as a knock-about: Throw it in the trunk of my car, take to the grandkids, let them bang it about, etc. Turns out for less than $150US, it's a monster guitar! In fact, I have it out sitting on my sofa, ready to play, as it's my current "exercise" guitar. Contrast that with the Taylors and Martins which cost substantially more. My fingers and ears don't know the difference. They can't feel or hear price.
Beautifully said @OldStrummer. Sometimes, the guitars that are “worth” the most to us, are the ones we have a history with. Sometimes your body and your ears “learn” to love that over time, and nothing else quite measures up.
For any one of us, that special friend might have been originally crafted in the Fender Custom Shop, but it is equally as likely to have been born of more humble origins.
The most intelligent discussion I've seen on any guitar-related forum in a long, long time.Quote:
Originally Posted by ajwain
And "ajwain" adds another perspective to the topic......as an aside, my "go-to" guitar remains a heavily-upgraded MIM '50s Classic Strat.
I don’t want to bash CS Fenders. I’m lucky enough to have a couple.
I’m an old-timer; my first Strat was bought new in 1978, and I still own it. I love it for what it means to me, not for it’s value, but honestly?? I Do own better guitars!
Over the years I’ve fallen in love with a number of Stratocasters; some cheap (relatively) and some eye-wateringly expensive. Because of the size of the investment though, it’s taken me until relatively recently to find CS guitars that I felt were worthy of their price. I’ve played hundreds and hundreds… maybe thousands… before I found what were (for me anyway) truly great guitars. Yet, I’ve found equally great guitars on my 40+ year journey, which would be regarded as budget instruments.
I passionately believe in giving all guitars their due, and in no way do I mean to downcry CS products, but I do feel they attract a feeling of mystical greatness, and that people do imbue them with a quality which is not present in production models. That simply isn’t true!
@phantomman illustrates my point perfectly. Even those of us who are lucky (or old) enough to afford a Custom Shop Strat… it doesn’t automatically become our favourite.
I like a lot of the Custom Shop stuff, some of it I even love: they just recently did a run of NOS '55 Strats w/a wide-pattern sunburst that I would pay a awful lot for if I could find one that had certain features.
That said, I don't particularly care for the aging they do on the relic guitars they put out. It just doesn't look right or real to me.
Nowadays, you can build something comparable out of parts & have it specifically tailored to whatever specs you like, from neck profile, fb radius, fretwire, finish, paint... Whatever you can imagine. I'd rather do that, honestly
Quote:
Originally Posted by ajwain
Precisely how I feel about it…
The relation between CS quality/greatness and prices is not always an equation. And though the Custom Shops of most guitar companies have become more of “boutiques” than proper “custom shops”, they do make excellent guitars. If you like one, buy it!
Ton of great information and opinions on this thread, thank you all for the information. I wish that I could try out a custom shop guitar before committing to buy. That’s a lot of cash if I decided that I didn’t care for it. Still thinking about going vintage too, but only 70’s.. no way I could afford a real 60’s.
I’d say you definitely shouldn’t spend CS money without playing it…. In fact, play as many as you can. I searched for years and gradually learned what the Custom Shop guitars were all about; Masterbuilts and Teambuilds (shhh! There’s no difference!!!), Time Machine and Limited Editions. Every guitar had a unique character and for the money, I have to say that I was indifferent to most of them. The only argument against what I’m suggesting is that should you take a punt and buy one and you ultimately end up not getting on with it, it will have a high resale value so you won’t lose a lot if you sell it later.Quote:
Originally Posted by RSFenderGuy
You don’t say where you are, but I’m in the UK and visited most of the big stores over the years, spending hours just sitting and playing every one I could get my hands on and drinking in every detail. It wasn’t a chore, it was great fun! I love shopping for guitars, even though it can be frustrating sometimes.
It’s worth the investment of time to find a really good one if you have your heart set on a CS instrument. Don’t ignore the second hand market or other production models. The latter are vital for comparison at least. You may even like one of those more than the Custom Shop alternative.
RSFenderGuy, I don't mean to pry, and I'm certainly not an expert by any stretch of the imagination, but what is your playing experience and what do you hope to achieve by buying a CS Fender?Quote:
Originally Posted by RSFenderGuy
I'm mostly a bedroom soloist, playing for 55 years or so, and it's taken me quite a long time to come to the realization that a top end guitar isn't going to make me sound better. Yes, it might feel easier to play, and that's a consideration, but I own a number of guitars both acoustic and electric, and the price I paid for them goes everywhere from free to "holy cow." And every one of them plays like a guitar!
You can spend your money any way you see fit. I spend my money (often ridiculously) the same way. But I realize that no guitar is going to make me a better player, and if I can play an everyday Fender Player and it sounds good to me, why not?
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldStrummer
I second that. I’m a gigging musician (weekend warrior, but I do play in a working band) and I agree.
I don’t think it’s wise to buy any expensive guitar without trying it and bonding with it.
Been there, done that.
I bought several guitars online, new and used. Experiences varied in success. For instance, I bought a very nice 1961 Reissue Gibson SG that was an outstanding guitar that I just didn’t like. Tried hard but never did.
On the other hand, I bought a new American Standard strat at a store, trying it first. I never loved another guitar as much as I love this one.
Being made at a Custom Shop doesn’t mean anything if you don’t like the particular instrument. And remember that many famous artists play standard instruments. A Custom Shop guitar will only make sense to you if it actually fits your needs.
Yes, I get that but…Quote:
Originally Posted by OldStrummer
I’m a working musician and sound engineer, doing most of my guitar playing in orchestra pit bands for amateur theatre. Having said that, I’m a very average player and I get most of my work because of my enthusiasm rather than my virtuoso playing!!
My skill as a player (or lack of it) makes me not worthy of owning most of the instruments I have. I’m probably a Squier Affinity Series kinda guy if everyone had their due, but I’m also a guitar enthusiast. This means that even if I can’t justify an expensive instrument on my merit as a player, I can still get immense pleasure from owning and cherishing one. It’s my prerogative as a consumer to buy something which I covet, and I don’t have to be a guitar god to justify it.
We all love it guitars - that’s why we’re here, so if we can aspire to own an instrument that’s designed for players way beyond our level of competence (and we can afford it) then good for us! I say “go for it” and buy what makes you feel good.
My only caveat is don’t buy it because everyone else thinks it’s good… buy it because YOU think it’s good!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by ajwain
And there you have it!
+1Quote:
Originally Posted by OldStrummer
I have been playing for around 35 years or so and have owned many guitars. I have an original 1989 HM strat that I purchased brand new, before that it was inexpensive Cort guitars and Japan made squire bullets, which I guess I should have kept!Quote:
Originally Posted by OldStrummer
Anyways, I like the necks and feel of the early 70’s strats, 72-73 but am not crazy about 3 bolt necks and the electronics of that era. A 60’s strat would be awesome, but price wise it’s just out of reach. I guess that is why I was looking at the CS strats.
I wanna go back to basics, just a nice playing / sounding strat with that early 70’s sound and feel.
no pedals, no effects. Just an amp and guitar.
Well see, this is [OPINION ALERT!] where it all comes together. In my opinion, the amp has as much to do with the sound of an electric guitar as does the guitar itself. Since what we're talking about here is physics, what you get is the total combination of string vibrations being transferred electronically via pickups to an amplifier (with or without pedals in the middle) which then emits the sound through the speaker(s) driven by the amp.Quote:
Originally Posted by RSFenderGuy
This is why people get so involved with pickups (single coil vs. humbucker), placement, string type and gauge, amp characteristics and speaker type (and number). Even the cords get under the magnifying glass for some.
There are fewer aspects to sound control and quality with acoustics, but you'll find the same level of specificity with some people: Wood type, body size (and shape), string composition and gauge, even pick thickness.
Maybe I'm an anomaly. In my self-effacing way, I just think of myself as adapting to the gear I have available than chasing a sound or tone like a holy grail.
Not a knock or dismissal of those who do look at the entire picture by examining every piece in the puzzle.[/END OF OPINION ALERT]
I wish more shops around where I am had custom shops I could try out. Probably only 2 shops that have maybe one in stock. Doesn’t give me a chance to know if I like them or not.
Where are you RSFenderGuy? Are there any guitar shows within travelling distance at certain times of the year?Quote:
Originally Posted by RSFenderGuy
If you can get to the 2 shops, at least play the ones they have… see if you like the feel and the vibe. If they’re Time Machine Series, they’re not for everyone, but at least then you’ll have a little bit of Custom Shop experience under your belt which you can add to.
You never know, one of those lone examples they have in stock might just choose you as it’s forever owner!
I am in upstate NY. We have a guitar center and of course the world renowned “House of guitars” but they each have only one I think. Might go fiddle with them today, as you said it will give me an idea.Quote:
Originally Posted by ajwain
Good luck man! Hope you enjoy it.Quote:
Originally Posted by RSFenderGuy
if you contact FMIC they should be able to provide you with the name of an authorized Custom Shop dealer in your area (not all Fender franchises are so designated). Many CS dealers will have some of those instruments in stock which will provide you with the opportunity to examine them first hand.