Help with DiMarzio stacked single coils

This is gonna be an odd question, so bear with me. I need help figuring out my guitar. :D

I haven't played my first electric guitar, a 1980 "The Strat" in quite awhile. It was stock for about two years, then in 1983 I (very unfortunately) decided to have it routed for a Kahler locking trem. Okay, whatever. It stayed that way for another decade.

Sometime after college I decided to have a guitar tech shield it, but the tech I always used suggested I try stacked single coils instead. This would have been like 1990 or so, maybe 1991. What I know for sure is that they are DiMarzio pickups. He installed push/pull pots on all three pot positions so I could select one coil only, or both coils (hum canceling).

I liked it a lot, but about a year later it began to develop bad problems with the jack. At that time I went on a humbucker kick and didn't pick it up again for years. When I got back into single coils in the late 90s, I went through various Teles and Strats but never really broke out the 81 again.

About two years ago I finally got it out, cleaned it up a bit and installed a new jack. I messed with it briefly, got confused and gave up.

Okay, so I got it out today, and found it sounds pretty darn nice through the DRRI. However, what's perplexing me is that with each pickup, if the push/pull pot is down, there is some buzz to be heard, thus making me believe that's single coil mode. When the pot is up, the buzz goes away.

Fair enough, except that when the pot is up (no buzz) the output is lower than when it's down (with buzz).

Does that make any sense to anyone? I must say that it sounds more humbucker-esque (almost EMG like) in the down position (with hum/buzz). Why would the output be lower with both coils engaged? Nothing sounds out of phase (i.e., thin and nasally) in either position. They both sound good, just one is louder, but louder with buzz.

Second question, if anyone knows, what stacked single coils was DiMarzio making then? I see they have like a zillion now on their website, but I'm just curious as to what I have. The pickups say nothing underneath except "DiMarzio." That guitar tech guy actually died in 1995, so I can't go back and ask him, nor do I still have any receipts from the swap.

Finally, the bridge pickup does not change sound, volume or buzz amount with its pot in either position. That sounds like a wiring glitch to me that I'll try to nail down later.

Okay... long enough. Anyone have any thoughts?

Oh, and another question. The top pot (volume) is very loose--I mean the shaft turns extremely easily. If I just slightly bump the knob while strumming, it instantly turns the volume down.

How does one "tighten" the turn of a pot's shaft?

My guess would be that when you pull up the coils are in parallel, but you said it doesn't sound like it. Have you ever opened up and looked at the wiring underneath? Maybe you could open it up and take some pictures and post them. I'm sure someone (other then myself:spin:) can look at the pics and tell you if it's wired wrong or whatever.

Hmm. I hadn't thought about that, series vs. parallel.

Taking pics of the inside is a good idea. I'll do that.

After viewing their website I'm pretty sure the tech used the term Virtual Vintage, and I see that they had some sets of those back in the 90s that have been discontinued and replaced by newer versions. I'm betting that's what they are.

However, nothing on their website suggests using three push/pull pots, so I wonder if that was just something the tech came up with.

Virtual Vintage is what I have in my Legacy.

You should post some pics.

BTW, if you don't get it figured out, I could take a look at the guitar and see what I can figure out.

Sorry, I got nothing.

DiMarzio is extremely helpfull on their Customer service. Send them an email.Once i sent an email very early one morning around 5 am. By 6am I had an email back ( i had asked which were the earliest Dimarzios, the dog ear tab mount flanges or the sqare flange like I have on my early Super D.-they said the square). Now thats awesome, someone at Dimarzio, mighta even been Larry, at 6-7am answering emails!
By the way,the YJM stacked single coils for middle and neck are tonally awesome.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Guitar_Mc

Virtual Vintage is what I have in my Legacy.

You should post some pics.

BTW, if you don't get it figured out, I could take a look at the guitar and see what I can figure out.

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Thanks H. I'll post some pics a little later this morning.

Anyone ever heard of a scenario like this where each pickup is somehow switchable? I guess I always assumed the idea was essentially just like a coil tap for each pickup if it was a traditional side-by-each humbucker. I've just never encountered it in another Strat before.

(And apparently never cared about it until yesterday. :laughing:)

Also thanks Jerry for the info about their customer service. Good to know that there's someone there who does field questions about legacy products if need be.

Okay, I'm just gonna do these as links because they are big pics.

External shot, pots in up position.

External shot, pots in down position.

I discovered that one of the pickups IS labeled. This must be the model number. I'll do some more research on that in a second:

Pickup closeup.

Wiring in four angles. Yes, I know the jack is no longer wired to the volume pot in all except for angle 4. Had to desolder it to get the pickguard to lay flat. :D

Wiring angle 1.

Wiring angle 2.

Wiring angle 3.

Wiring angle 4.

That pickup is a Dimarzio HS3 and they still make and sell that pup.

Go here for more info. http://www.dimarzio.com/

Not sure about your wiring cause it just looks like a big mess but it looks like your Tech may have wired it to split the coil with the push Pull pots ? Not sure.

I have never tried that on my HS3's. I usually use stock 250k Pots with them and have it wired for series. Black and white wire soldered and tape together. Green and Ground go to Ground . Red wire to 5 way switch. In series it sounds stratty to me or stratty enough. I can only imagine the parallel and split would sound weaker but I have never tried that on a HS3 so......

I have one Strat with a HS3 in the Bridge, HS2 in the Middle and YJM in the Neck. All are wired for Seriies. Sounds good to me.

If its noiseless than it's probably wired for series or parallel.

If it Hums it 's wired for split.

For example. ( I know this works for a Seymour Duncan Hot Rails so....)

A HS3's DC resistance is 23.772 ( According to the site )

If you have an Ohmeter or Digital Multi-Meter or can borrow one from a buddy or whatever., Measure the DC resistance from the Output Jack. A quick and easy way would be to plop a guitar chord in and measure the tip and the sleeve ( Make sure the volume pot is all the way on )

In Series it should be around 23-25k or so and I'm quessing that Each is 12k or so....
(This is how it's done with a SD Hotrails but each coil is 8k so.. )

Series ( Full Power no HUM )= 24k
Split ( Just 1 coil and it will Hum) = 12k
Parallel ( No Hum ) = 6k

Good luck and let us know how you made out.

Learned a couple things.

First, I'm betting the bridge push/pull wasn't working because one of the two wires that went to the push/pull stud was accidentally screwed up into the assembly of the pot when it was attached to the guard. It looks like it was then grounding out against the pot.

I also learned my Strat is a 1980, not 81 (so I edited the info above). Interesting.

Haven't googled the name of the pickup or emailed DiMarzio yet about them. I did go ahead and put a new guard on the guitar and new pickup covers.

I'm going to clean up and chrome the Kahler bridge before I reassemble the guitar to make sure my wiring fix was right.

Totally Bored--thanks for the info, I was posting at the same time you were so I didn't see your post until just now.

As near as I can tell from the lug he used he did definitely mean it to split the coil from pot up to pot down. Why it's quieter when it's not humming I don't know. Still trying to figure that out.

Aha!

It was actually in a DiMarzio wiring diagram Guitar_Mc sent me this morning:

Quote:

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Single-Coil Switching (Coil Tapping, Coil Splitting): Single-coil switching will produce a brighter, cleaner sound. With all side-by-side Humbuckers, the volume will be less than with standard series humbucker wiring. With vertical humbuckers, such as HS- and Virtual Vintage series, the volume will be slightly greater as long as the coil closest to the strings (the one with red and black wires) remains on.

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Mystery solved.

Thanks Guitar_Mc!!!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Totally bored

That pickup is a Dimarzio HS3 and they still make and sell that pup.

Go here for more info. http://www.dimarzio.com/

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From DiMarzio's site:

We originally created the HS-3™ to be a warmer bridge-position companion to the HS-2™. Yngwie Malmsteen adopted it for his standard neck and bridge pickup, and almost overnight the HS-3™ acquired the reputation of being a high-powered metal pickup. This isn’t really the case; —the HS-3™ is actually a smooth and relatively quiet pickup that produces a sweet overdrive tone without jagged edges. What Yngwie discovered is that these qualities combine perfectly with a heavily distorted amp, because the sound won’t get muddy or messy. The HS-3™ is also versatile—it’s a noise-free pickup in a live situation or in the studio.

:ha

Silly me, comparing it to Gravity Jim's silky-smooth EMGs.

I guess as soon as I plug it into my eight Marshall Stack's I'll hear it as God (i.e., Yngwie) indended it. :D

"Single-Coil Switching (Coil Tapping, Coil Splitting): Single-coil switching will produce a brighter, cleaner sound. With all side-by-side Humbuckers, the volume will be less than with standard series humbucker wiring. With vertical humbuckers, such as HS- and Virtual Vintage series, the volume will be slightly greater as long as the coil closest to the strings (the one with red and black wires) remains on. "


Hmmm .... maybe I should try that out with some push pull pots ?

It's actually a really interesting bonus to have the single coil sound be louder than the stacked sound.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by pc

Aha!

It was actually in a DiMarzio wiring diagram Guitar_Mc sent me this morning:



Mystery solved.

Thanks Guitar_Mc!!!

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I'm glad the answer was in there.
(I could take credit if I had read it and knew that the answer was in there) :D

I just figured those schematics would help you identify what the tech was trying to do.

Anyway...
(Must resist temptation to pull Legacy apart... Must put solder gun away...)