Cakewalk?

I've been throwing myself out there to do random non-commital pedal steel/guitar for bands, and have gotten a few bites. It occured to me the other night that it might benefit me to get some kind of recording software, so's I can take a band's recording, paste my playing on top of it, and send it back to them via internet, 21st century style. It would also be cool to be able to record some of the song ideas that have been floating around in my head for the last several years.

I was just looking at "Cakewalk SONAR Home Studio 6" on MF for $99. Does anybody know anything about this? Good or Bad? Is there better for the same $$$ or cheaper?

What I'm looking for:

-Affordability
-Ability to create drum tracks
-Decent built in compressor
-Decent amp modelers
-anything else you can recommend for my situation

The last band I was in recorded with a friend of the band that had a "studio" in his parent's garage. I remember on the computer screen you could see the individual tracks, one on top of the other, scrolling horizontally across the screen. He was grabbing clips from here and there, pushing them to the left or right channel, ramping the volume up/down at certain parts, etc. Does this sound familiar? Does the Cakewalk Sonar 6 do anything like this? It seemed like a pretty intuitive format.

I'm a complete newb to computer recording software, so go easy on me! Thanks.

Also, I'm guessing since I'm on a laptop, I'm going to need an external hard drive. Is there a cheap one you guys can recommend, and how easy is it to rig this up?

Thanks again.

Cakewalk's products are fairly nice. To be honest, in the small fish to semi-pro realm, most of the available products within a given price range offer near identical features and capabilities. So for what you're looking for, this product will work equally as well as anything else in that range.

Where to caution you is in the future. What you record today, you very well might want to bring into something else tomorrow. This is where competing products can tend to differ. Cakewalk's products save to uncompressed wav files for each track, so importing into other software later is easy. Not all products do this, so read the fine print before you buy.

Audio recording is one of the hardest evolutions a hard drive will encounter. It would be good advice to always record onto a different drive than you use for other programs, data, or operating system. External drives are fine, but unless you plan on using a drive only once per project, you'll probably want at least two drives. One to record on, and one to preserve your projects after they're complete. Eventually, the recording drive will fail, and you don't want it to do that still holding everything you've ever recorded. Everything will be lost. Most projects can be backed up to DVD and archived that way, but they will prove impractical for frequent use, because paths within the stored project won't be the same as what was recorded.

I use Sonar 7 and it does a fine job! It's a lot easier to set up and use than Cubase, etc. The only thing I don't like about it is the User Guide blows chunks!

Also, I just found out that MF is blowing out Sonar 6 for $99
It's got to be worth a try.

Free: http://www.kreatives.org/kristal/

Free plugins:http://free-plugin-list.com/

What OS are you using?

What's OS? Operating system?

Yeah...:D

Ok, my operating system (assuming that's windows/mac/whatever--told you I was a noob) is Windows Vista, 32-bit. I've only got like 1014MB to work with. I bought the cheapest laptop they had at Best Buy because I bought one for $1300 last time and it only lasted 3 years. So I decided if the $400 version lasts 3 years, I'm ok with that.

Anyway, that free stuff looks cool, but it's got to be free for a resason, right? What sets the Cakewalk/Protools stuff apart, better sound quality?

For what you want to do this stuff will work great...

Sound quality is almost all just as good as anyone could care. You'll get 44k sampling which is CD good.

Free is no issue. Audacity will let you do all that looking at the track going by and cutting and pasting. You don't get the drums.

I'm getting some serious mileage out of Garageband these days. Dig myspace.com/thenardsrock page for some nice drum sounds (if I do say so myself!)

Ditto. All my stuff is done in Sony Acid. No drummers needed!

Colin, try Acid X-Press, it's free!

Thanks for the help guys. Rick those drums do sound pretty good.

How's Garageband/Sony Acid? Is it somewhat affordable and still usable for what I'm doing?

Garageband is a Mac software that comes in the iLife suite. It uses the Logic engine.

Logic is taking on ProTools in a big way.

Absolutely. The link above is to Acid xpress. It's free and will do loops, overdubs, and up to six tracks of stuff. Call me and we'll talk more about it. I did the basic drums on Powerglide in Acid 2.0 on the laptop I'm typing on...:dude

There's a sticky at the top of the JamZone that might be useful. :ola
http://www.thefenderforum.com/forum/...ad.php?t=35881

I wrote it up a few months back after answering essentially this question a dozen or so times. It's from the "how do I get my feet wet for practically free" perspective -- and there really is some very good freeware out there if you're not quite sure you want to dive into a whole new avenue of G.A.S. or drop a few hundred bucks on hardware and software.

Sounds to me like a key for you will be converting back and forth from, say, mp3 to .wav and back again (many, many recording programs use .wav, many music file sharing host sites use the smaller, compressed mp3 format). Trying to fit yourself into an existing mix is a new skill in and of itself... but in time, even the JamZone monkeys can do it.

'Hope that helps.

Thanks for that link Clayville, very helpful. I never would have known it was there though, because I don't go into the JamZone very often...though I would if I could participate!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by clayville

Trying to fit yourself into an existing mix is a new skill in and of itself... but in time, even the JamZone monkeys can do it.

'Hope that helps.

---

Hey,I resemble that remark...........pass another banana,will you? :band

Oops... I meant the JamZone Monkees!
http://www.zumablog.com/images/120/M...31812679231133

http://img57.imageshack.us/img57/703...olanderoq1.jpg

Alright, I need help again. :bonk

I tried downloading a compressor from Chris's post (Free plugins:http://free-plugin-list.com/) and I can't get the file to open. I'm running Windows Vista, does anyone know how to make this thing work? It just keeps telling me it doesn't know which program I want to use to open it. I don't know either. :wah:

I also tried a compressor from Clayville's link from the sticky (http://www.kjaerhusaudio.com/classic-series.php), no luck there either, same problem.

Any advice?

Does it ask you to "browse" to the program you want to use (Cakewalk)

Yes it does ask me that. I'm not using Cakewalk though, I'm using Sony Acid Xpress (free trial version). I looked for that when "browsing" but it wasn't in there, only Microsoft Paint, Microsoft Word, Internet Explorer, Adobe, etc. etc.

Tried using Adobe, it doesn't recognize the file and tells me so, Internet Explorer just asks me again and again if I want to open or save the file.

I hate computers! Need to get my reel-to-reel working again. :(

Ok, I just found Sony Acid in the "browse" window after a little bit of searching...but that won't open it either. It's an "unsupported file type".

Maybe Xpress, being a trial version and all, doesn't allow plug-ins? There's a few other features it barrs me on, and tells me I have to purchase the full version to use.

Maybe I need to buck up and just spend the 100 clams on Cakewalk home studio 6. :332:

Vst plugins are not typically "stand alone" applications. They are add-on tools used by the recording software. They will not open like other documents (.doc will open with Word and .xls will open with Excel), most vst's are DLL files.

You will need to locate your shared vst directory on the hard drive, and copy or move the DLL file into it. Try looking in Program Files for a vst plugin directory, possibly under Acid Express' installed directory. Then launch your recording software; it should automatically load the new plugin (if it supports vst plugins - most applications do, some do not).

Once the plugin is loaded, depending on the type of plugin, you can use it as an "effect" or as an "instrument". Instruments generate sound from midi sources, and effects alter audio sources. Some plugins will offer features as either an effect or an instrument.

To use an effect based vst plugin, you may need to add it to the track after it is recorded, or add it to the mixer bus during recording. If you can locate where you typically add other built in effects like reverb or chorus, you will generally see your new plugin also listed at the same place as an option.

To use a vst instrument, you may need to add the instrument first, and then apply it to a track. Depending on the software used, you may need to do this for each new instrument used in a given recording. New recordings may not remember which instruments you added for prior recordings, and will need to be added again. This technique is typically used to minimize memory useage by only loading instruments if/when you need them.

I'm not familiar with Acid Express, so I can't give a step by step set of instructions, but many of the recording packages I've used work in similar fashions. When in doubt, look in the help file for the application for instructions on using vst plugins.

There is a free program located online called "SaviHost", which is a vst "host" application. It allows you to try out a new vst in a semi "stand alone" way. It is a useful tool to have on your computer, especially if you're going to use a lot of free plugins. You can test drive the new vst before you go through the trouble of adding it to your recording software. A great many "free" vst plugins are not very good, though there are a number of exceptional ones around. Vst's loaded into your recording software can eat up valuable memory even if not being "used" in a project, so weeding out the poor implementations early on will save you a bit of grief later on when you decide to get rid of a few.

Wow, thanks for the primer Mesotech, just what my :da needed. Lot of info there, I'll be referencing this thread for sure.

Well I looked into it and apparently I'm barred. Everything you'd want to use to improve the sound of your recording (aside from some crappy sounding keyboard effects) are not included in the free trial version. Oh well, what was I expecting for free anyway?

I think I'm going to buy Acid Music Studio, it's only $70 and seems to have what I need.

Thanks everyone! More dumb questions will certainly follow! :dude

Hey...Sorry I didn't get back to you. The freeware version does have limitations, but IMO ACID is just the shiznit. Go for it!

That's okay, I was little cranky that night anyway. I don't have a lot of patience for computers. :D

I just downloaded Acid Xpress. Is it a limited-time evaluation, or a defeatured freeware version, and is it easy to use? I'm a :da, ya know...but I need to have some more inspiring drums than my SR-16 offers...hopefully there are more natural sounding loops than the one used as a demo! :D

RJ I saw your other thread first, and told you what little I know in there. And as you know we are all :da's here so you're in good company. :D

I'm pretty sure, based on this
http://sony-192.vo.llnwd.net/dspcdn/...cid_readme.htm
that the Acid Xpress demo doesn't support VST plug-ins but Acid Pro does... but I could be wrong. Seems odd to me, but that appears to be the case.

FWIW, the freebie recording programs out there that I've tried (Audacity, Kristal, Reaper) all accept VSTs. And... even though there are a lot of clunkers and poor realizations in the world of free VSTs, having the ability to find and use the good ones (or the really wild weird ones you'd never pay for) is one of the great joys of home recording.

This link has some (old, but...) decent advice about how plugs work, where to put them, etc.
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jun0...pcmusician.htm

Bottom line is that in practice they need to be opened from within your recording software -- usually in the Mix window on individual tracks (or on the master track). Depending on your monitoring set-up, you can usually hear the result of the effect/plug-in while recording even though it isn't actually captured on the track permanently, and you can add them or subtract them after capture too. They aren't actually 'burned to disk' until the track (or your final mix) is bounced out of the recording program.

I still think trying the freebies to see if you like the process is a darn useful way to get into it before dropping significant coin. Sure the commercial products work and sound better, and are more elegantly designed, etc... but almost any platform is going to benefit from patience and determination to get over the initial frustrations along the way.
:Banjo:

RJ, Hit me with an email. I've got something that will make you happy.:D
neelfilmmusic at yahoo dot com