intonation blues

[chasenblues]

not sure if i'm in the right spot for this question but i'll try anyway.
i have a strat style guitar of unknown origin that i'm having problems trying to set the intonation on. all of the strings are showing that they are sharp on my tuner but the bridge saddles are adjusted as far as they can go back. any suggestions

[stratcat55]

Check the neck. Too much bow can effect intonation.

[Guitar_Mc]

i have a strat style guitar of unknown origin

Or, it might have the wrong neck. It might be the wrong scale length or a neck with 21 frets (or 22 with an overhang) where there is supposed to be a 22 fret (with no overhang on the fret board). This would shift your scale back by the distance between a 21st fret and 22nd fret.

[telecast]

a neck with 21 frets (or 22 with an overhang) where there is supposed to be a 22 fret (with no overhang on the fret board). This would shift your scale back by the distance between a 21st fret and 22nd fret.

Er, no. That's some really bad information.

A scale length is a scale length. The number of frets has absolutely nothing to do with it. A 22 fret neck does not push the neck out farther. On any given scale, the 12th fret is half the distance from the from the nut to the bridge. That does not change with the number of frets. You could have a 12 fret neck, and the distance from 12 to the bridge would still be half the scale length.

This is one of the reasons a lot of guys don't like the LP Double cut. with 24 frets, the neck pickup had to be moved closer to the bridge for clearance. The extra frets forced the pickup out of the magic spot, but the 12th fret did not move, it's still 12 3/8" from the bridge, just like on a LP Standard.

There could be several reasons your guitar isn't intonating. My guess is the nut is cut improperly. If you tell us more about the guitar, type of bridge, type of nut, if the guitar is modded in any of those areas, etc., we may be able to suss it out.

[photoweborama]

Well I'm sure Guitar Mc the right concept that the neck may be a short scale neck on a long scale body, but true, the number of frets has nothing to do with it.

[chasenblues]

there is not a name on the peg head but i have a feeling who ever built it was going for the "shredder" look because it's angled downward trying to look like a early kramer or jackson. the neck is straight, no twist's, humps or anything it is also maple. the body is your standered looking strat type, the bridge is also a plain strat type. it looks to be in pretty good shape except for the springs for the lenght adjustment now being squashed between the back of the saddle and the end of the bridge after attempting to set the intonation. the guitar is not anything special a friend gave it to me so he wouldn't have to keep lugging it around with him. the nut seem's ok... i'm beginning(?) to think that it's the peg head it's self, when i slapped a set of strings on it because of the angle of the peg head the tuning machine's for the E and B strings are "out on a limb" on the end of it. i think because of the angled peg head the tuning machines are not where they would normaly be. because of the downward angle the peghead its self is longer than on a regular strat type guitar. wouldn't that make the scale/string lenght longer ? the bridge saddle's are maxed out can't go back anymore

[chasenblues]

the middle pup is just about flat on the pickguard, i play without a pick so the nails on my index/middle/ring fingers was getting caught on the staggered poles pcs so i lowered that one. i have limited access to the web (have to use the library ).so when i get pack to the ranch i'll lower the neck pup and try again. what do you think of the peghead theory is it possible?

[Guitar_Mc]

Er, no. That's some really bad information.

A scale length is a scale length. The number of frets has absolutely nothing to do with it. A 22 fret neck does not push the neck out farther. On any given scale, the 12th fret is half the distance from the from the nut to the bridge. That does not change with the number of frets. You could have a 12 fret neck, and the distance from 12 to the bridge would still be half the scale length.

I'm talking about where the neck pocket is cut into the body. Not the scale length changing due to the number of frets.

If you take a 25.5" scale neck with 21 frets off of a guitar and put a 25.5" scale neck that has 22 frets (without an overhanging fretboard), your intonation is going to be messed up. The problem is that there is now a longer distandance between the heel of the neck and the nut, which results in longer than 25.5" from nut to bridge.

Neck with overhang..


On my G&L guitars, there are 22 frets without the overhang. The neck pocket is routed further back.

Since chasenblues doesn't know the origin of the guitar, a mismatch of neck and body could be the problem.

[telecast]

Ok, that's much clearer.

[Guitar_Mc]

Ok, that's much clearer.

If you thnik my comnumiaction sklils are bad wehn tpyed, you sohuld try tlaknig to me. The skool sistems hvae raelly falied me.

Chasenblues,

Get out a tape measure and measure the distance between the nut and the bridge.

[telecast]

If you thnik my comnumiaction sklils are bad wehn tpyed, you sohuld try tlaknig to me. The skool sistems hvae raelly falied me.

Ohio State?

[Kap'n]

On my G&L guitars, there are 22 frets without the overhang. The neck pocket is routed further back.

Guild bolt-ons from the 80's are done the same way.

[Guitar_Mc]

Ohio State?

[stratcat55]

Lower your neck and middle pickups flush with the guard. Re-check your intonation.

Yep that too. Start with the simple things first. Could be just string pull.