What makes for an exceptional Stratocaster

For those of you who are strat players, what makes one exceptional
Above all the average ones?
How do you know when you have a great one? What does it have or what doesn’t it have?
For example — I love teles and Les Pauls. The tele came to me real easy, but the Les Paul I looked for my whole life. It has the look and it’s light. It has the perfect neck, modeled after the Carmelita. It has low output humbuckers the one thing that surprised me though was it isn’t very loud. I had a gold too with a baseball bat neck that was loud and sustained for days, but it wasn’t in the same league as this
So what makes a strat great? No issues with intonation or tuning ? The neck? The string tension? What is it?
Thanks

Comfortable neck, plenty of sustain, and somewhere around eight pounds (or less).

Usually a great player makes a great Strat.

A keeper? Let's see:

1) Stays in tune
2) Volume and tone controls work well over full range
3) Good fretwork, everything level and smooth, all frets clean sounding
4) Nice bite on the attack
5) Notes "bloom" with tone rolled off
6) The 2 and 4 positions have a nice quack without a big volume dropoff
7) No intonation issues
8) It makes you happy

For me everything else is internet BS. If you put a picture of your favorite guitar on the internet it always ends in heartache because somebody, somewhere will tell you what's wrong with it.

Then there's the definition of "good." Good for what? A slow blues ballad? A balls-out southern rocker? An intimate jazz trio gig or a classic rock band? Everyone one else will have their own opinion. The best Strat for me to use comes down to the song. I have one Stratocaster that only gets used on one song. It's the perfect sound for that song but not much else. I have one old beater that's more of a Swiss Army S-style but It's still not the correct one for all situations.

And some of my guitars work better with Marshalls and others with Fenders, so amp selection is a huge part of the equation.

All that said, what seems to be common attributes for me (lookng at my workhorse guitars)

Alder bodies,
Two Point trems
6130 frets (most modern Fenders I think are using 6105 which are too tall and narrow and wear a bit too fast for my liking)
Headstock truss rod adjust
Modern saddles (usually)
A chunky C shaped neck
Whatever pickups - as long as they're bright and glassy
And all boringly equipped with D'Addario 10-46 nickel.

so that formula works for me.

The reality is that the "best" Stratocaster for you is going be a journey of discovery and your tastes will evolve as you play. You may love steel strings over nickel, you may want a punchy Strat that has that country sizzle or bloomy round-sounding one. You may like a V neck, a D neck, a skinney C, a baseball bat or whatever. You may prefer a satin neck over a gloss one. You might prefer ash over alder, or poplar. You may want SSS, HSH or SSH pickups. Noiseless or vintage.

Strats are like women, infinite in their variety, and we can't even come to consensus over the binary choice of Ginger or Mary Anne. For me, girls begin and end with Julie Newmar in cat-suit, but some guys dig the Cardassians.

So in short, dig what you dig. Try a lot of them out. Figure out what you like and finally, believe about 1% of what you read on the net, including this.

Chuck

Great answer, lol. So true

BTW, welcome aboard! Good to see new folks.



I left the maple vs rosewood part out to keep the flame wars down.

When the one in your hands clicks all the right boxes, and you don't even know, or care why. It just feels great to play it.

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Originally Posted by Offshore Angler

BTW, welcome aboard! Good to see new folks.



I left the maple vs rosewood part out to keep the flame wars down.

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Because we all know that maple is the only logical choice, right? {ducking and running}. :roflmao

Lumber types have different timbres, no doubt about it. But that doesn't necessarily mean that one is "better" than the other. Just different. Like a red Camaro and a blue Camaro.

I usually like something a little more traditional, but sometimes you can mess with the formula and have a wonderful guitar!

This doesn't sound like a wood Strat- it's got its own thing going on, but it's damn nice sounding. I just put a $49 set of Bootstrap pickups in it. Wow! They sound nice!

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...3ceb47ac_b.jpg

I love that Strat, Don.

I've played excellent, cheap copies and excellent, expensive CS Strats. For me, though, it comes down to feel and playability because honestly, no matter which Strat I've recorded myself on, they all sound similar. They sound like me. So if a guitar is comfortable to play and has no impediments to playing it well, that's the Strat for me.

Lightweight resonant body, straight neck with no fret issues that have you cranking the action too high because the guitar neck needs work. I'm a big advocate for going to a guitar store and trying them out. Knowing that some folks don't have that option, a good setup from a local guitar store always does wonders, regardless of what you receive in the mail.

Dan Erlewine explained that truss rod adjustment is often the reason a guitar is dead sounding. I used to play with a fair amount of relief. I was told it's killing your sustain and making it sound all rubber-bandy. I thought it was hogwash but starting at curious I took a decent Strat and reset the neck dead flat which puts a lot more tension on the truss rod. I was completely amazed at the difference. Completely.

On a Tele, Whooo friken' hoo! Katie bar the door! It's the secret sauce for them.

So, I had to readjust my playing a little but what a reward.

That Erlewine guy may have a career in guitars, lol!

Chuck

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Originally Posted by Offshore Angler

Dan Erlewine explained that truss rod adjustment is often the reason a guitar is dead sounding. I used to play with a fair amount of relief. I was told it's killing your sustain and making it sound all rubber-bandy. I thought it was hogwash but starting at curious I took a decent Strat and reset the neck dead flat which puts a lot more tension on the truss rod. I was completely amazed at the difference. Completely.

On a Tele, Whooo friken' hoo! Katie bar the door! It's the secret sauce for them.

So, I had to readjust my playing a little but what a reward.

That Erlewine guy may have a career in guitars, lol!

Chuck

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I went through this with the USACG on my Strat. The guitar sounded flat and dull with the amount of relief that I preferred. I tightened the truss rod and the guitar came to life.

1. Neck (shape, construction)
2. Resonance, unplugged
3. weight

Pickups, Hardware and other stuff can always be changed out.

Fantastic response from Offshore Angler. A lot of what ticks the boxes for any given player is entirely subjective (such as weight, neck carve etc. ), but things like tuning stability and reliable electronics are beyond question.
I have a problem with anyone citing acoustic resonance as being an attribute of a “better” guitar. An instrument which is “alive” and rings throughout the wood is a feel good thing for the player, but it categorically doesn’t translate to a better plugged in tone. It does make a difference to the sound at high volume, but it isn’t always for the better!
It could be argued though, that if the player enjoys the playing experience more because the guitar is light and resonant then he/she will create a better performance. I have 40+ years of semi-pro work which have taught me that lightweight guitars that ring, don’t necessarily sound good at gig volume.

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Originally Posted by ajwain

Fantastic response from Offshore Angler. A lot of what ticks the boxes for any given player is entirely subjective (such as weight, neck carve etc. ), but things like tuning stability and reliable electronics are beyond question.
I have a problem with anyone citing acoustic resonance as being an attribute of a “better” guitar. An instrument which is “alive” and rings throughout the wood is a feel good thing for the player, but it categorically doesn’t translate to a better plugged in tone. It does make a difference to the sound at high volume, but it isn’t always for the better!
It could be argued though, that if the player enjoys the playing experience more because the guitar is light and resonant then he/she will create a better performance. I have 40+ years of semi-pro work which have taught me that lightweight guitars that ring, don’t necessarily sound good at gig volume.

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I'll agree with you on Fenders, but Les Pauls, man you pick one up and strum it and you just know! I remember Peter Frampton talking about the Phenix. He claims it doesn't matter what pickups are in it. BTW, I too subscribe to the idea that say's pickups make a lot less of a difference than pickup manufacturers and internet wannabes want you to believe.

It really comes down to is it playable and can you play it?

Chuck

Wow this a throw back thread I never responded to.

For me, when you play it, regardless of something easy or complex, does it inspire you? That’s the whole feel thing. If you’re not inspired by it, it’s going to always sound like crap to you regardless of specs, options, add ons, etc. or what ever gear you go through. Don’t buy with your eyes, buy with inspiration 1st and your ears 2nd.

That may seem odd to not have ears 1st, but if it doesn’t inspire you, it’s honestly worthless to you; regardless of how it sounds.

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Originally Posted by Offshore Angler

I'll agree with you on Fenders, but Les Pauls, man you pick one up and strum it and you just know! I remember Peter Frampton talking about the Phenix. He claims it doesn't matter what pickups are in it. BTW, I too subscribe to the idea that say's pickups make a lot less of a difference than pickup manufacturers and internet wannabes want you to believe.

It really comes down to is it playable and can you play it?

Chuck

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In my opinion, it’s absolutely true of Les Pauls! There’s a significant component of the sound that comes from the wood; the choice of wood and the construction is absolutely crucial to the “voice” the guitar has at volume. The point I was making (and what my lifetime of owning and playing Les Pauls has taught me), is that the acoustic ring (resonance) doesn’t matter a jot, other than to the player.

Interestingly and timely, I just watched a YouTube video in which Joe Bonamassa put together a Hendrix Band of Gypsies rig with all the period-correct vintage gear, and then reproduced it with a $300 Squier Strat and modern affordable pedals and a C30 and then A/B them.

The difference was so small it wouldn't make a difference in a live gigging scenario.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Offshore Angler

Interestingly and timely, I just watched a YouTube video in which Joe Bonamassa put together a Hendrix Band of Gypsies rig with all the period-correct vintage gear, and then reproduced it with a $300 Squier Strat and modern affordable pedals and a C30 and then A/B them.

The difference was so small it wouldn't make a difference in a live gigging scenario.

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I also saw a video of John 5 playing a John 5 tele through whatever the clean channel of whatever amp he uses with Marilyn Manson nailing “How High The Moon” by Les Paul. If it had been overdubbed on top of an old black and white video of Les himself playing through a goldtop you’d be none the wiser.

I think pickups can make a difference but it’s marginal gains. Even pickup types. I still have a hard time differentiating my P90 guitar from my Humbucker guitar. A bit of squish on the buckers is about all I can tell. Honestly same with my Tele and my new Strat (okay…PRS Silver Sky SE). Tele has deeper and thumpier lows but honestly they’re fairly interchangeable.

For me, in my experience over the years, the thing I remember about the 'exceptional' Stratocasters that I have held, played, borrowed, tried-out, or owned was the tones.
The unique, head-turning sounds that that particular guitar managed to make when plugged into just about any amplifier.

It's a given that Strats feel just right, and feel great to hold and play.
And I have never met one that wanted to go out of tune.

(Well. Except for one Squier that I did a set-up and restring for a friend. That one was a turd, and it would not stay in tune or intonate to save its life. It must have been made on a Monday.)


I can recall very clearly the few instances in my life where one or two Stratocasters just knocked me out with their sound.
And I'm happy to report that I own one of them.
A 1991 Strat Plus, and it's a keeper for life.
It's in my Last Will & Testament to my granddaughter.

:Banjo:


https://www.thefenderforum.com/forum...5dfu1KTV16n//Z
https://www.strat-talk.com/attachmen...xe-jpg.699230/https://www.strat-talk.com/attachmen...xe-jpg.699230/

(Well. Except for one Squier that I did a set-up and restring for a friend. That one was a turd, and it would not stay in tune or intonate to save its life. It must have been made on a Monday.)

More likely it was built in late January on the day before Tet celebration began......

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Originally Posted by Sparky2

It's a given that Strats feel just right, and feel great to hold and play.
https://www.thefenderforum.com/forum...5dfu1KTV16n//Z
https://www.strat-talk.com/attachmen...xe-jpg.699230/https://www.strat-talk.com/attachmen...xe-jpg.699230/

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I take a small exception to that. It may be a "given" for you, but I don't think that's necessarily true for everyone.

I have found that neck shape plays an important part for me in how a Strat feels. OK, so I have small hands and thin fingers. I rarely have problems with acoustic guitars but will openly admit that I like the narrower nut width. But an acoustic is traditionally a 12" radius, whereas Fender Strats go all over the map, from a 7.5" radius to 12", with 9.5" being the "norm." Combine that with the neck profiles offered by Fender ("D", "V", "C", "Soft V," "Modern C," "U," "Flat Oval," etc.) and you have a witches' brew of choices. And they don't all feel the same. What would be the point if they did?

Take for example, my 2016 Eric Clapton Artist Series Stratocaster. It has a lovely (to me) "Soft V." My Custom Shop Robin Trower Signature Stratocaster has a "Large C" shape. Both have 9.5" radii. Put a Michael Landau Signature Strat in my hands with its 7.5" radius, and my fingers are going to have trouble. I already apply acoustic guitar pressure to my electrics, and I'm going to have the high e string bending off the neck all the time!

So, I don't think it's a given that every Strat just feels right. I admit that I don't think I've ever heard a Strat that doesn't SOUND right, though.

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Originally Posted by OldStrummer

So, I don't think it's a given that every Strat just feels right. I admit that I don't think I've ever heard a Strat that doesn't SOUND right, though.

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If you're primarily an acoustic player or have spent decades on a Gibson fretboard then a Strat with a vintage-spec neck (ie: 7.25" radius and small frets) will likely feel alien to you and may (as you mention) be difficult to play. But for those of us who grew up with Strats from the '50s, '60s, and '70s, they feel comfortable -- like an old pair of Converse All-Stars or a favored easy chair. That doesn't make these guitars 'right', or wrong for that matter. They are what they are and players must adapt in order to make friends with them or go with the more "modern" spec necks with flatter radius boards and fatter fretwire.

I apologize for ruffling any feathers with my opinions.

I'll do my best to keep them inside from here on out, and strictly stick to scientific, clinical, irrefutable facts.

:salud:

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Originally Posted by Sparky2

I apologize for ruffling any feathers with my opinions.

I'll do my best to keep them inside from here on out, and strictly stick to scientific, clinical, irrefutable facts.

:salud:

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No feathers ruffled on my part. I enjoy discussion, and there's nothing wrong with a difference of opinion. If all we did was spout "irrefutable facts" I think we'd probably be bored to tears. Not to mention have very little to talk about. Carry on!

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Originally Posted by OldStrummer

So, I don't think it's a given that every Strat just feels right. I admit that I don't think I've ever heard a Strat that doesn't SOUND right, though.

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Back in the mid '80s, I had a '57 Reissue Strat that was a DOG!!! It was dull, flat, dark, lacked sustain... We tried everything (within reason) to make that Strat sound good.

I should've known- it was brand new and had been in a shop with decent turnover for well over a year, and I got it cheap. But I knew nothing about Strats and wanted one so bad.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Offshore Angler

Interestingly and timely, I just watched a YouTube video in which Joe Bonamassa put together a Hendrix Band of Gypsies rig with all the period-correct vintage gear, and then reproduced it with a $300 Squier Strat and modern affordable pedals and a C30 and then A/B them.

The difference was so small it wouldn't make a difference in a live gigging scenario.

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I saw that. Great video! There are great guitars at all price levels. Often, for me, the biggest difference between price levels is feel. And the guitarist's skills matter a lot more than the gear. It's more like Supercross than Formula 1.

First consideration for me is the weight. And that's not just about comfort. I think a light guitar just sounds better. Particularly Telecasters but Stratocasters, too.

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Originally Posted by Cogs

First consideration for me is the weight. And that's not just about comfort. I think a light guitar just sounds better. Particularly Telecasters but Stratocasters, too.

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So long as the body isn't chambered or fabricated from styrofoam.

:bonk

Would you accept hollow aluminum? (It's actually not substantially lighter than a wood guitar).

https://photos.smugmug.com/Guitar-Lo...MG_0685-XL.jpg

I might find that interesting, but more as a novelty. I'm one of those kooks that thinks that wood &/or materials matter even with electric guitars. I don't like poplar or basswood strats & teles. I prefer the ol' standbys of ash & alder. I don't know about pine or sycamore or sassafras

See there you have it. I love poplar bodies on an S-style guitar. Others don't, and it's all good.

What I think I've learned over the last 50 years of playing is to pick them up in the store and try them. When you find one you like, you'll know it. Anything you do online is a total crapshoot.

I've had vintage Strats that were total dogs but I sold them for top bucks, and I have players that I likely couldn't sell for $250 that I can't put down. Last night's show I played my kit built Les Paul and it was really nice.

The best advice I can give you is NEVER EVER confuse price with "great".

Unfortunately, we now live in a market where most high-end guitars are marketed more to collectors more than players and we see that in the prices.

I frequent a really, really nice music store that is a premium PRS dealer. It's funny to watch the guys that come in and try out and buy the expensive toys. Most of them can't play for sh!t but they go on and on about the "tone" (which is hilarious because they never get to try them in anger in a mix) and how well the quilted top moves.

And at the HOG I've seen the same scenario play out with custom shop Fenders, when very often the real players are over picking through the FOJ Strats and Teles to find one they like because many of us prefer FOJ to the Custom Shop and at a fraction of the price.

I mean, yeah, we all drool over a Murphy Lab burst, but they don't sound or play on average any better than any US Standard.

Pick it up, plug it in, play and let your hands and ears tell you if it's worthy.

Chuck

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Originally Posted by Offshore Angler

The best advice I can give you is NEVER EVER confuse price with "great".

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This should be etched in stone. Everywhere.

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Originally Posted by OldStrummer

This should be etched in stone. Everywhere.

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+1000!

Remember all the poor shlubs who back in the '80s bought Cadillac's Cimarron?

:roflmao:roflmao:roflmao

I think you owe me a new monitor and keyboard! :roflmao

It all goes back to, does it inspire you as a guitarist.

I don’t care if it’s $ or $$$$. Actually tone is secondary to me, first it has to play well and inspire me. If it meets that and the tone is there, plus bonus points for lighter weight (bad back), then I consider buying it.

Even if it plays great, if it doesn’t inspire me, it’s worth nothing to me.

This fella's got some pretty good observations
https://youtu.be/r2vpU3hgbRs?si=n1UijSM37R1r-vGG

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Originally Posted by bluesroom

For those of you who are strat players, what makes one exceptional
Above all the average ones?
How do you know when you have a great one? What does it have or what doesn’t it have?
For example — I love teles and Les Pauls. The tele came to me real easy, but the Les Paul I looked for my whole life. It has the look and it’s light. It has the perfect neck, modeled after the Carmelita. It has low output humbuckers the one thing that surprised me though was it isn’t very loud. I had a gold too with a baseball bat neck that was loud and sustained for days, but it wasn’t in the same league as this
So what makes a strat great? No issues with intonation or tuning ? The neck? The string tension? What is it?
Thanks

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That’s an entirely personal matter.

Many players state that only real vintage guitars will do it for them.

Others will settle for vintage specs, and there will be Custom Shop worshippers and Mexican part magicians among them.

Mike Rutherford (Genesis) started loving Squier Bullets after gigging with one and still seems to play them live.

Me? I have an easy reply to your inquiry and it has three words: American Standard Strat

I thought I saw it here, but maybe I was mistaken. Joe Bonamassa, acknowledged by many to be a guitar master, took a challenge to recreate Jimi Hendrix's Band of Gypsys rig and sound. He started with using the same components as Hendrix, as detailed by records of Hendrix's gear. He then put together a comparable rig using some much less components. YouTube shows he came pretty darn close.

The Hendrix rig would cost somewhere in the neighborhood of $60,000 today. The second rig, headlined by a $319 Squier Stratocaster would run around $1,200.

The article and demo videos can be found here.

Here's a quick breakdown of each rig's gear:

Hendrix Rig	Clone Rig
1969 Fender Stratocaster in Olympic White (Est. value: $35,000-$45,000)	Squier Stratocaster (Est. value: $300)
Vox Wah ($1,500-$4,000)	Dunlop JH-1D Wah ($95-$169)
Tycho Brahe Octavia ($2,500-$4,500)	Dunlop JH-OC1 Octavio ($211-$320)
1970 Dallas-Arbiter Fuzz Face ($1,900-$4,000)	Dunlop JHF1 Fuzz Face ($120-169)
Shin-Ei Uni-Vibe ($3,500-$4,500)	MXR M68 Uni-Vibe ($83-$129)
1969 Marshall Super Lead ($4,500+)	Peavey Classic 30 ($400)